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Sorry, too bored/not bothered to read through all these posts.  I found all the rational thought I needed when Mike Rowe commented...

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Mike – I read several months ago that you got the vaccine. I’m glad. But I’m also curious. You have a lot of people on this page who respect your opinion - many of whom I’d wager are unvaccinated. Have you encouraged them to follow your example? If not, what are you waiting for? As you surely know, Delta is raging. The sooner we’re all vaccinated, the sooner we can get back to normal!

Steve Manchin

Hi Steve

The short answer is no - I have not publicly encouraged anyone to get vaccinated. In fact, I have recently declined to participate in several PSA's designed to persuade people to get the jab. That’s not because I’m opposed to vaccines, obviously. Vaccines have saved more lives than any other advancement in the long history of medicine, and to your point, I got the shots the minute I was eligible. But I’m not a doctor, Steve, and even though I occasionally play one on TV, I’m not inclined to dispense medical advice to the people on this page.
 
True, I did appear in a few PSA’s early on, back when they assured us that locking down was essential to keeping our hospitals from being overrun. “Two weeks to flatten the curve!” Remember that one? That of course, turned out to be untrue, and I regret my role in helping perpetuate that particular falsehood. I also regret what I said during the first Zoom show to air in primetime. It was an episode of After the Catch, where I discussed the lockdowns with a few crab-boat captains. At one point, I looked into the camera lens on my computer and said, with uncharacteristic earnestness, “For the first time in a long time, it appears we’re all in the same boat.”
 
Well, I was wrong about that, too. We were not in the same boat, not then or now. We were in the same storm, but our boats were very different. Some prospered during the lockdowns and rode out the gale in yachts and pleasure crafts. Others floundered and weathered the storm in rowboats and dinghies. Some had no boat at all and hung on for dear life to whatever flotsam and jetsam they could find. Point is, I said some things I regret back then, and spoke too broadly to too many. Thus, the only thing I’ll say now regarding the vaccine, is that there is risk in everything we do, and there is risk in everything we don’t do. Thus, there is risk in getting vaccinated, and there is risk in not getting vaccinated. Obviously, I made my decision, but again, I’m not a doctor. Thus, I am not equipped to answer questions like, “But Mike, if the vaccine is so safe, why hasn’t the FDA approved it? Or, “But Mike, if the vaccine is so effective, why is the government now treating us all as if we’re unvaccinated?”
 
These are fair and reasonable questions, and I have no logical reply. Here in California if you’re inside, you must now wear a mask, vaccinated or not. What kind of message does that send?Yes, we have a new variant, and from what I’ve read, it’s highly contagious, but far less virulent – especially if you’re vaccinated. According to the CDC, just one 1 in 27,000 vaccinated people have contracted it. That means if you’re vaccinated, you’re more likely to get struck by lightning than contract COVID. And yet, people are once again calling for more lockdowns, more restrictions, and more compliance from those who already got their shots.
 
The fact is, millions of reasonable Americans have every right to feel confused and skeptical. Those people you refer to, Steve – the ones now telling us that we can “get back to normal just as soon as everyone is vaccinated” – those are the same people who said, “two weeks to flatten the curve!” Those are the same people who told us that masks were “useless” before they told us they were “critical.” Those are the same people who told us that a return to normalcy would occur just as soon as “the most vulnerable” among us were vaccinated. Then, just as soon as “half the population” was vaccinated. Then, just as soon as we achieved “herd immunity.” Those are the same people who told us they wouldn’t trust ANY vaccine developed under the last administration. Now, those very same people are belittling the skeptics!
 
If this were a Peanuts cartoon, those people would be Lucy, pulling away the football at the last moment while a nation full of Charlie Browns land flat on their collective back, over and over and over again. Those people you refer to - elected officials, journalists, and most disturbingly, more than a few medical experts - have moved the goalposts time and time again, while ignoring the same rules and restrictions they demand we all live by. They’re always certain, usually wrong, incapable of shame, and utterly void of humility. Is it any wonder millions find them unpersuasive?
 
I’m sorry, Steve, but even if I were an actual doctor, I wouldn’t know what to say to the skeptics on this page. But as a fake one, I’ll say this. Every single American who wants the vaccine has had the opportunity to get it – for free. Those who have declined will not be persuaded by the likes of me. At this point, I’m afraid the the government has but one course of sensible action - get the FDA on board, stat, and then, provide an honest, daily breakdown of just how quickly the virus is spreading among the unvaccinated, versus the vaccinated. No more threats, no more judgments, no more politics, no more celebrity-driven PSA’s, no more ham-fisted attempts at public shaming. Just a steady flow of verifiable data that definitively proves that the vast, undeniable, overwhelming majority of people who get this disease are unvaccinated.
 
In other words, give us the facts, admit your mistakes, try on a bit of humility, and stop treating the unvaccinated like the enemy.

Mike

PS Dirty Jobs, as the attached photo should prove, is coming back. New episodes probably start in October. The doctor will see you then...

May be an image of 1 person and indoor

 

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United mandating vaccines for employees:

https://apnews.com/article/business-health-coronavirus-pandemic-airlines-e8eef8e8f11d4924b81768484e5401a1

Rumors are that Delta's not far behind. Multiple Fortune 500 companies are issuing mandates. And of course, DoD is about to cave, too.

 

It'll be interesting to see how forthright these freedom-loving patriots are when their income is threatened.

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21 minutes ago, joe1234 said:

United mandating vaccines for employees:

https://apnews.com/article/business-health-coronavirus-pandemic-airlines-e8eef8e8f11d4924b81768484e5401a1

Rumors are that Delta's not far behind. Multiple Fortune 500 companies are issuing mandates. And of course, DoD is about to cave, too.

 

It'll be interesting to see how forthright these freedom-loving patriots are when their income is threatened.

Well if your choice is starving or getting the vaccine you aren't really free to make a choice are you? 

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Just now, FLEA said:

Well if your choice is starving or getting the vaccine you aren't really free to make a choice are you? 

I suppose there's always welfare. 

After all, liberals love to say the same thing about jobs...

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5 minutes ago, pawnman said:

I suppose there's always welfare. 

After all, liberals love to say the same thing about jobs...

I don't disagree with liberals assesment about jobs. I would love to see some more society protect to give people some breathing room enabling them to take more risk later in life. Would be great if I could just up and quit work to full time search for a potentially better opportunity. 

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14 minutes ago, FLEA said:

Well if your choice is starving or getting the vaccine you aren't really free to make a choice are you? 

Well, over 90% of the UAL pilot group is already vaccinated after being offered a few hours of extra pay to get it. I suspect that population is much like the one here in that it has more than it’s fair share of vaccine skeptics. Apparently, a good chunk of the skeptics were willing to put their very strong feelings and concerns aside for a few extra bucks. I’m sure there will be some holdouts in the remaining 10% who refuse. I’m sure Transair or NAC would happily hire them after UAL lets them go. Also, I hear we are critically short of truck drivers. So, yeah, they have a choice. 

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I enjoyed Mike Rowe's comments, especially the part about "all in the same boat."

For so many Americans, this has been a horrific, frightening, devastating time.  For millions of others, this pandemic has been the greatest thing they can imagine.

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26 minutes ago, Prozac said:

Well, over 90% of the UAL pilot group is already vaccinated after being offered a few hours of extra pay to get it. I suspect that population is much like the one here in that it has more than it’s fair share of vaccine skeptics. Apparently, a good chunk of the skeptics were willing to put their very strong feelings and concerns aside for a few extra bucks. I’m sure there will be some holdouts in the remaining 10% who refuse. I’m sure Transair or NAC would happily hire them after UAL lets them go. Also, I hear we are critically short of truck drivers. So, yeah, they have a choice. 

That’s not reasonable to expect an airline pilot to change careers because they don’t want a medical procedure.

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55 minutes ago, dogfish78 said:

That’s not reasonable to expect an airline pilot to change careers because they don’t want a medical procedure.

Private company, they get to make the rules...or does that only apply to drug testing?

One thing this pandemic has been good for is watching left and right swap talking points.

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6 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Private company, they get to make the rules...or does that only apply to drug testing?

One thing this pandemic has been good for is watching left and right swap talking points.

Haha I will agree with you on that one. But I think it's more the hypocrisy that exist in both sides. 

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6 hours ago, FLEA said:

Well if your choice is starving or getting the vaccine you aren't really free to make a choice are you? 

the choice is to be employed there or not, which you are definitely free to make.

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5 hours ago, arg said:

Biden said 350 million people in the US got the vax. So I guess we’re done with that.

image.thumb.png.3366c910e6429ccfdb42d1c1b51ea015.png

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On 8/5/2021 at 7:02 PM, tac airlifter said:

Quote for me exactly where I said “intentional bioweapon release.”  Because I specifically said accidentally funded.  No idea why it was released; but an accident is more plausible than intentional to me.

Your entire post is predicated on me saying something I did not say.  

Then don't call it a "Chinese bioweapon." When you call it a bioweapon that implies a high level of intentionality both in the development and release of the virus.  Words mean things. If what you actually think is it was a lab accident then just say that and resist the temptation to get hyperbolic. 

 

It sounds like we actually agree on this, for what it's worth. 

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Then don't call it a "Chinese bioweapon." When you call it a bioweapon that implies a high level of intentionality both in the development and release of the virus.  Words mean things. If what you actually think is it was a lab accident then just say that and resist the temptation to get hyperbolic. 
 
It sounds like we actually agree on this, for what it's worth. 

Just because you read into it and think it says that doesn’t mean that it’s what it implies. Just because he said bioweapon doesn’t mean that he said it was intentionally released. If you have questions about what he means then ask. Don’t put words in his mouth or tell him he needs to say one thing or another. We are getting dangerously close to forced speech. But that doesn’t mean you can tell any of us what to say and we can’t tell you what to say. Just that you are being disingenuous.
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3 minutes ago, Guardian said:


Just because you read into it and think it says that doesn’t mean that it’s what it implies. Just because he said bioweapon doesn’t mean that he said it was intentionally released. If you have questions about what he means then ask. Don’t put words in his mouth or tell him he needs to say one thing or another. We are getting dangerously close to forced speech. But that doesn’t mean you can tell any of us what to say and we can’t tell you what to say. Just that you are being disingenuous.

You can say whatever you want. But don't get upset when you use ridiculous, over dramatic labels for things and then other people take those labels to their logical conclusions. 
 

While we're at it, why not call it an American bioweapon? We helped fund the research after all..

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You can say whatever you want. But don't get upset when you use ridiculous, over dramatic labels for things and then other people take those labels to their logical conclusions. 
 
While we're at it, why not call it an American bioweapon? We helped fund the research after all..

I wasn’t upset and they weren’t my comments. Take a breather. You’re getting all worked up over your own words.

Feel free to unbunch your undies
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On 8/6/2021 at 2:20 AM, Pooter said:

The idea this is an intentional bioweapon is just pure silliness. If you made a bioweapon to mess with the US why would the epicenter of the release be in your own country? Why would you choose an airborne, difficult to control, and not particularly deadly disease? Not to mention, we all know lockdowns and masking don't stop the problem, and China has many of the largest, most dense cities in the world which were "magically" not hit hard like every single other city in the world was. Now do we think this is because they beat covid? Or maybe they're lying about their numbers. Which do you think is easier for the government to pull off?

Lockdowns certainly increased the benefits of buying abroad and through the internet. China specializes in outsourcing goods and shipments. Can’t imagine how any sort of lockdowns (stifling local purchasing) would benefit the economic hegemony China enjoys…/s

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