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COVID-19 (Aka China Virus)


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15 hours ago, drewpey said:

Reading comprehension is hard.  This is all it takes for someone to not comprehend what they are reading and start spreading stupid shit telling people masks make COVID-19 worse.  If you have a medical mask then sure, it's worse...but for those who don't it's better than nothing.  It's spread through droplets in the air, so while it may not catch all the particles, if it catches any you are likely better off protecting yourself or others with a cloth.  Also it keeps mouth breathers from constantly touching their mouth and spreading germs everywhere.  Wear one of the 50 shemaghs you've been issued, a handkerchief, a homemade mask or that old N95 sitting in your garage for years.  Aircrew as a community immediately pillory anyone for not consulting an expert and making uneducated statements with regards to aviation...yet we constantly see people particularly in this thread turn their nose up at the nation's leading experts  because they think they know better.  It's like a dude trying to convince his fellow airline passengers not to listen to the aircraft commander and ignore the oxygen mask that just fell from the ceiling because his bro once told him sometimes it just happens.  Why question it...it's literally not hurting anyone to put a mask on and hopefully it will end this whole thing 69 seconds earlier.

Nice dig. 

The nation's leading experts are recommending the widespread use of masks -- not to protect the wearer from acquiring the virus -- but to help prevent those with the virus from spreading it further.  For example, coughing with a mask on probably reduces the distance of the droplets.  If you're within radius of the droplets though, and have a mask on, it probably wont do shit.  My reading comprehension taught me that cloth mask filtration with virus is almost 0%. 

"Self-contamination through repeated use and improper doffing is possible. For example, a contaminated cloth mask may transfer pathogen from the mask to the bare hands of the wearer. We also showed that filtration was extremely poor (almost 0%) for the cloth masks. Observations during SARS suggested double-masking and other practices increased the risk of infection because of moisture, liquid diffusion and pathogen retention"

 

"In the interest of providing safe, low-cost options in low income countries, there is scope for research into more effectively designed cloth masks, but until such research is carried out, cloth masks should not be recommended."

 

To answer the previous question -- no there was no control vs effectiveness against no mask at all.  So, is throwing a bandana over your face more effective when walking around walmart?  Maybe, maybe not.  If someone with the virus sneezes near you... no, its not going to do shit.  If the virus is on your mask, is it more likely to stay there due to increased moisture retention?  Yes.  If some dumbass with the virus is out in public and wearing a mask, will it slow their infectious rate down? Probably.  Could people walking around with masks now have an increased false sense of security, and start to relax their hygiene and other counter measures?  Maybe. 

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These horror stories of police arresting people on the beach or dragging people out of church are way overblown.  The media is going to over-report anything that will get views and outrage--similar to

The Crozier situation has sparked many illuminating conversations up and down the chain.  No, we don’t know all details but the core issues ring true to anyone who has experienced mid-level authority

You went from making a reasonable point to saying religious people should all get together and give themselves coronovirus because they’re stupid.  Not sure why or how you made this leap, but maybe yo

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Guys, it's not hard.

Wash your hands, don't touch your face, stay home if you can. If you have to go out, stay 6 feet away from people/social distance if possible, and wear a mask in order to reduce/slow transmission of the virus. The mask is for those around you, in case you have the virus and are contagious but not yet symptomatic.

Keep your mask clean, change it out when it gets moist. Assume it's dirty when you take it off, so wash your hands. That goes for cloth masks, n95 respirators, surgical masks, bandannas, etc.

If you are sick, stay home.

These are the TTPs we have right now, hopefully we can get more research into it and industry to move on a future solution to enable better TTPs.

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This dude won’t make it through the day.  Calling the commander of the TR “naieve and stupid” to his former crew...what an assclown.

 

https://www.foxnews.com/us/acting-navy-secretary-ousted-uss-theodore-roosevelt-captain-stupid-naive-coronavirus

 

and here’s the audio he broadcasted to the ship’s crew

https://youtu.be/G7mwlwO0mdM

Edited by b52gator
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2 hours ago, rancormac said:

 If some dumbass with the virus is out in public and wearing a mask, will it slow their infectious rate down? Probably.

Great, wear a fucking mask since there's a ton of people who are asymptomatic and don't even know. They're not dumbasses since we can't even get tests to most of the folks with some of the symptoms. 

They wouldn't test any of my Airmen/buddies who didn't have all the symptoms:

One dude had all of them but the fever..."no test, not COVID-19." 
One dude's wife is positive, no test for the rest of the family, they only had fevers and slight cough..."no test, not COVID-19."
Another guy had all the symptoms, not healthcare worker..."no test, not COVID-19."
Buddy in another Sq, all symptoms and had to get carried into the ER, not healthcare worker, "no test, not COVID-19."  He had to have his family carry him to the bathroom he was so exhausted.

More data will become available and we'll adjust.  Acting like something isn't a perfect solution so why try...are you a Col/GO?

This whole thing is the greatest example of "it's not about you" and give a shit about your fellow human being.

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1 hour ago, nsplayr said:

https://warontherocks.com/2020/04/the-navys-crisis-of-special-trust-and-confidence/
 

I thought this was an excellent write up of the USS TR incident and how the Navy (mis)handled things. 

Anytime I see any version of the phrase "Lost confidence in his/her ability to lead" it makes me cringe. I think we all know that it's a line for a WIDE range of offenses, unfortunately. I know we don't need to know all the details, but it's just become too much of a catch-all IMHO.

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13 hours ago, 17D_guy said:

One dude had all of them but the fever..."no test, not COVID-19." 
One dude's wife is positive, no test for the rest of the family, they only had fevers and slight cough..."no test, not COVID-19."
Another guy had all the symptoms, not healthcare worker..."no test, not COVID-19."
Buddy in another Sq, all symptoms and had to get carried into the ER, not healthcare worker, "no test, not COVID-19."  He had to have his family carry him to the bathroom he was so exhausted.

This is going to have the effect, intentionally or not, of reducing the reported caseload, making containment efforts look more effective. And of course, making the death rate look even worse.

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I rarely go out, but when I do for finite resources I wear a mask and gloves. Being respectful of others and no one exactly knows the actual effectiveness good/bad percentages wise, but having the resources especially if you (I am that guy) tour the world on a frequent basis (every month) it is my duty to remain aware and apart from others in order not to jeopardize them or their families. My area is relatively naive and a third at best now wear protective gear, but they stay clear of those with masks thinking we might have this virus and rightfully so. Mask makes me personally aware of my face so I dare not touch it. I do not believe I have it since I was checked in Mar positive for the flu type B (now I wonder if you can have both as the testing stopped there, who knows). Either way, it’s a mild nuisance, we have all had chem gear training of some sort; therefore, you can add common sense measures when you arrive home discarding gloves, mask, clothes in the wash, getting sprayed in the face by my wife before I escaped to the shower after a world trip. Overkill perhaps, but it’s not hurting anyone and prudent in regards to things I care about. Company gives me kits so I use them, no big deal for me. 

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I'm just frustrated at how this mask guidance came out.  On a Sunday afternoon, instructing people who largely aren't supposed to be leaving the house to come to work Monday with a mask... From somewhere?  And the Air Force wasted no time dictating appearance rules for the masks... But provided zero resources to anyone to fulfill the guidance.

Maybe it is better than nothing, but it seems like a lot of higher level leadership decisions.  Can't do anything smart, can't solve the problem... But they can do something visible so they don't get fired for "not doing enough".

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28 minutes ago, pawnman said:

I'm just frustrated at how this mask guidance came out.  On a Sunday afternoon, instructing people who largely aren't supposed to be leaving the house to come to work Monday with a mask... From somewhere?  And the Air Force wasted no time dictating appearance rules for the masks... But provided zero resources to anyone to fulfill the guidance.

Maybe it is better than nothing, but it seems like a lot of higher level leadership decisions.  Can't do anything smart, can't solve the problem... But they can do something visible so they don't get fired for "not doing enough".

Agreed, although my base put out guidance on how to sew your own mask from household materials.  Like with a sewing machine; because we all use those things...

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12 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

Agreed, although my base put out guidance on how to sew your own mask from household materials.  Like with a sewing machine; because we all use those things...

I’ll be sewing mine with the standard issue sewing kit from initial AF inprocessing. It’ll probably be about two weeks before I can make it in. 

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Mask fabrication techniques and filtration effectiveness aside, this is just the latest in a laundry list of half-assed mitigation measures put in place by leadership to simply look like they're doing something. 

Want to hear another one?  UPT bases are currently doing two-team alternating day ops with half the IPs/studs flying one day while the other half has the day off.  The idea is to mitigate the spread by reducing total pool of people you interact with.  Which sounds like a decent idea until you consider the fact that they're all working in the same building, sitting at the same desks, flying the same airplanes, and storing their gear in 6-9 inches from someone else's in a cramped peg room.

My buddy's quote referencing this policy: "it's almost like we're doing something.. to look like we're doing something.. while not actually doing anything at all."  

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53 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

Agreed, although my base put out guidance on how to sew your own mask from household materials.  Like with a sewing machine; because we all use those things...

Should be great for that 18-year-old airman in the dorms.

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Air Force: You are mission essential!  You and your job are so critically important we need you to continue to come to work during a pandemic.

Also the Air Force: make a face mask out of an ABU sock

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I was rocking the last-minute cut-out fabric off my black T-shirt from the black boot days, folded through two rubber bands. Look like a ghetto Shinobi. Fit's worth a shit but hey, 'resiliency'. 😄

3 hours ago, Majestik Møøse said:

Put a trash bag over your head with a rubber band around your neck, that’ll keep that shit out.

Sounds like sage advice for that SECNAV clown to take right about now.

 

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23 minutes ago, HU&W said:

One wing commander put out a policy at 0700 this morning that masks will be ocp print or ocp colors to match the uniform.  

I guess anyone who was at work prior was sent home to get into the proper uniform?

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I guess anyone who was at work prior was sent home to get into the proper uniform?

And that’s when you leave and don’t come back for the rest of the day.

I’ll laugh if someone tries to chief over this. I already don’t have to get my haircut, who gives a what color my bandana is?


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