Jump to content

COVID-19 (Aka China Virus)


Orbit

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, pawnman said:

I'm hoping they get out. I've got a batch of solid cadets...cutting some officers who can't do basic statistics makes room for cadets who are motivated, vaccinated, and desperately want to be Air Force Lts.

So since you understand statistics so well what is the statistical probability (in a percentage form, or cases of 100K) of developing a long term side effect from the Phizer COVID-19 vaccine? Looking for the exact probability based on current evidence, not an intuition based assessment. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 hours ago, Pooter said:

Hope everyone who choose to die on this vaccination hill gets some immense satisfaction out of sticking it to big blue. Because that's likely all you're getting.
 

The staunch anti vax dudes I know of are invariably the squadron shitbags, who spend way too much time publicly arguing politics on Facebook, and who will not be missed by anyone.. least of all the commanders who are relishing this excuse to get a complete liability out of their organization.
 

The number of people who discovered their extremely sincerely held religious beliefs on stem cells just this past week is particularly rich. You'd think a supposedly principled person would think twice about faking a religious belief to justify their stubbornness, but I'm sure the crippling case of Dunning-Kruger prevents that level of introspection. 

Your analysis is about as small as the people you must be friends with. I've noticed no correlation between shit bags and vaccine status. What I have noticed on both sides are people that you would never guess of having a position suddenly having one.

 

It's also hilarious hearing how many people are suddenly advanced medical professionals with nuanced perspective on the safety and efficacy of vaccines. Face it, you're pro vaccine because you were told to be. Just like me. Just like how you, I, and everyone else out there believes 95% of what we know because that's what we were told. It's a positive trait of the species to be able to transfer knowledge, but now that the knowledge transfer industry has accelerated to a pace we are completely unprepared for (thanks to internet and social media specifically), so all of the original gateways of information that for the most part kept everybody believing largely the same things (which were largely correct) are now defunct.

 

And the gasoline poured on this fire were the bureaucrats and politicians. They haven't changed, they have always lied to influence our behavior, but now their lies are exposed in a way they have never experienced. And regardless of what side you're on, people respond to lies in a pretty predictable way. They stop trusting you. Sure, if the lie was something that you were already positioned to believe, then you are more inclined to let the lie slide. Think Republicans with Trump and liberals with Fauci. But the distrust spreads.

 

So yeah, fall victim to all the human nature quirks and play directly into the hands of the politicians who are only interested in our money and our votes. If you disagree with me you're a shitbag, if you agree with me you're the enlightened. That should fix things.

 

Disclaimer: I am fully and voluntarily vaccinated with the mRNA vaccine.

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, pawnman said:

I'm hoping they get out. I've got a batch of solid cadets...cutting some officers who can't do basic statistics makes room for cadets who are motivated, vaccinated, and desperately want to be Air Force Lts.

From everything I've seen, you will be one helluva squadron commander..

  • Like 1
  • Haha 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, torqued said:

My argument has always been that the vaccine is not completely safe and that vaccine is not completely effective.

Evidence continues to leak through the massive propaganda wall that this vaccine is neither.

I LOL'd because it was obvious you don't understand the table. The denominator is already in the table. FIRST COLUMN. WTF? I continue to LOL because I can't believe I have to point this out

All Old People (>50) Delta COVID Deaths (Denominator) - 1644

Vaccinated (Numerator) - 1054

Unvaccinated (Numerator) - 437

You are trying to bury the evidence in "denominators of all old people deaths for all reasons" when the fact of the matter is the deaths in that table are being attributed to COVID. Yes, old people die of a lot of things. But these are all the deaths in the UK being attributed to COVID by a positive specimen test and after receiving a vaccine. If the people in your denominators were dying from other old people reasons, they wouldn't be recorded in the table. Why would any of them be recorded as dying of COVID if they are vaccinated, and at higher rates (in the same row) than unvaccinated? It is because the vaccine doesn't work as advertised?

Yes, I am arguing there is evidence to suggest the vaccine does not reduce the rates of hospitalization and death to the extent that it should be mandatory for everyone. Breakthrough infections. A outdated vaccine that was manufactured for the original genomic sequence and one that will continue to mutate even if 100% of the population receives this vaccine.

Somehow I get the impression no one in your SQ cares about your personal assessment of their character.

 

Actually there is missing data there. I'm going to use extremes to make the point, but you'll almost certainly find that it applies here.

 

Those numbers don't show the cohorts of the overall population and vaccine status. So, simplified, 1500 deaths, 1000 vaccinated and 500 unvaccinated. But that's out of a population of 15000, where 1500 are unvaccinated and 13500 are vaccinated. 500/1500 = 33% mortality amongst the unvaccinated, 1000/13500 = 7% mortality amongst the vaccinated.

 

And the follow-up to that would be that if the entire cohort were  unvaccinated, you would have 5,000 deaths instead of 1500.

 

Again, the percentages are simplified and exaggerated, but I believe you will find they apply to the data set.

Edited by Lord Ratner
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:

s also hilarious hearing how many people are suddenly advanced medical professionals with nuanced perspective on the safety and efficacy of vaccines. Face it, you're pro vaccine because you were told to be. Just like me. Just like how you, I, and everyone else out there believes 95% of what we know because that's what we were told. It's a positive trait of the species to be able to transfer knowledge, but now that the knowledge transfer industry has accelerated to a pace we are completely unprepared for (thanks to internet and social media specifically), so all of the original gateways of information that for the most part kept everybody believing largely the same things (which were largely correct) are now defunct.

 

And the gasoline poured on this fire were the bureaucrats and politicians. They haven't changed, they have always lied to influence our behavior, but now their lies are exposed in a way they have never experienced. And regardless of what side you're on, people respond to lies in a pretty predictable way. They stop trusting you. Sure, if the lie was something that you were already positioned to believe, then you are more inclined to let the lie slide. Think Republicans with Trump and liberals with Fauci. But the distrust spreads.

 

So yeah, fall victim to all the human nature quirks and play directly into the hands of the politicians who are only interested in our money and our votes. If you disagree with me you're a shitbag, if you agree with me you're the enlightened. That should fix things.

 

Disclaimer: I am fully and voluntarily vaccinated with the mRNA vaccine.

Point taken on the numbers. I understand what you're saying and I do believe the vaccines are somewhat effective for many of the people, but I still believe the reported numbers themselves are ripe for manipulation. Even when I'm referencing them, I know you cannot remove all subjectivity within them.

With regard to trust, this is how it is violated:

Oregon reports COVID deaths as "probable" exposures, any deaths 60 days after hospitalization, or any death certificate diagnosis regardless of the date.

Doctors and Hospital "marketing" staff are manipulating numbers to scare people.

A large amount of hospitalizations are mild or asymptomatic.

You can't sue either a pharmaceutical company or the government for harm caused by a forced vaccine.

The CDC reported 83% of Americans already had COVID anti-bodies in May. Far above the herd immunity threshold. Why do they need the vaccine?

I can provide hundreds of other sources, but it boils down to exactly what you've said. Too many lies. The biggest conspiracy theory is that the government genuinely cares about your health. But they're not lying for lying's sake. These misrepresentations and justifications for everyone to be required the take vaccine leads in an obvious direction towards an obvious goal, and it is not the overall health and well being of people. Again, I am not in any way against someone making the choice for themselves to get injected with vaccine as long as it's a free choice.

Edited by torqued
  • Upvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 hours ago, BrightNeptune said:

What are the details of that separation? 

Non-voluntary separation with the pay that goes with it? Honorable discharge? ADSCs removed?

Anecdotal, but I talked to an Army guy the other day who said 7 in his unit were quickly booted with general discharges for refusing the shot.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, torqued said:

This is not related to this discussion at all, but I thought this story about a teacher indoctrinating his students and rewarding them for adopting his positions was interesting.

 

Also unrelated: Why are public schools giving books to students about encouraging faggots to suck child penis as being okay?

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, pawnman said:

So Bashi's public health advice is just spit into each other's mouths until everyone gets covid, everyone who dies is an acceptable loss?

Pretty arrogant.  But maybe it's that single-seat mentality. Fuck anyone who isn't you...you got yours, your own risk, everyone else just shouldn't be old and fat, it's their own fault.

Brilliant.

Navigator cope used: ad hominem.

Why: @pawnman is insecure.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, dogfish78 said:

Also unrelated: Why are public schools giving books to students about encouraging faggots to suck child penis as being okay?

 

I believe there are two books with the same title, and very different story lines. Likely an ordering mistake, and some mom blowing it way out of proportion. 

Are you like some Chinese guy half way across the world trying to incite division and fracture america? Just curious. 

 

If not, I'll take this "faggot" covering my ass any day over you dude. 

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

45 minutes ago, hockeydork said:

I believe there are two books with the same title, and very different story lines. Likely an ordering mistake, and some mom blowing it way out of proportion. 

Are you like some Chinese guy half way across the world trying to incite division and fracture america? Just curious. 

 

If not, I'll take this "faggot" covering my ass any day over you dude. 

 

 

You're defending homosexual child molestation books in public school? Dude what? & how does your (((TEDx))) talk relate to my post? Oh yeah, it doesn't. You're derailing the topic.

If anyone is the Chink shill, it's you. You try to slide on patriotic topics. Review my posts if you will. I have posted nothing but information that is conducive to discussion about desiring a cohesive and strong nation of our people by supporting and defending the Constitution of the United States of America. I call out you pussies and shills on this forum and watch you whine. I don't want to be your enemy, but I call it like it is, and always will do so. Our nation needs strong men, will you join us patriots? 

If I was a Chink, I'd be posting about useless topics to keep you all distracted like professional sports, Black Lives Matter, and pornography.

Remember how Hunter Biden's nudes (with some very uh... young looking women) and methamphetamine pipe photographs got leaked? No? It was probably memory-holed from you ever seeing it. Blackmail is used often, including by the CCP. They own the current administration.

MilitaryCelebratingLGBTPrideMonth.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, DirkDiggler said:

Copy.  Like I said, I'm speculating but my guess is whatever discharge the military gives for this will not be a straight honorable discharge because of the nature (refusing a direct order) and to be quite honest the UCMJ is on their side.

  If you don't mind me asking, do you want to get out because of the mandatory COVID vaccine or did you want to get out anyway and this just presents an opportunity to do so? 

The latter. The mission broke me and I'm done. I've participated directly in ending many lives for no purpose. Those people could still be alive and there would be no difference. Who knows if they were even bad people. Showing up overhead just to waste a random dude that is no threat to you, your family, or your country takes it toll after you have been doing it for years on end.

You know the flashback scene in the third Bourne movie with Jason, his trainer, and a dude in the corner with a hood over his head and handcuffs? Jason was told to pick up the gun and shoot him. The trainer would not answer any questions. I picked up that gun and shot many people and watched them bleed out live and in high definition. I can't do that anymore. (No, I did not "fly" a drone, I was there overhead)

I'm pretty much at the end of my UPT ADSC and want out ASAP before these idiots in charge find a new way to sacrifice my life in order to give them a bullet on their next OPR.

I have yet to be convinced I need the vaccine, either. If I was a free man I would not get it until I am convinced that it will benefit me. I'm not a free man and there is now a gun to my head, so I guess I will be getting it shortly.
 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, dogfish78 said:

You're defending homosexual child molestation books in public school? Dude what? & how does your (((TEDx))) talk relate to my post? Oh yeah, it doesn't. You're derailing the topic.

If anyone is the Chink shill, it's you. You try to slide on patriotic topics. Review my posts if you will. I have posted nothing but information that is conducive to discussion about desiring a cohesive and strong nation of our people by supporting and defending the Constitution of the United States of America. I call out you pussies and shills on this forum and watch you whine. I don't want to be your enemy, but I call it like it is, and always will do so. Our nation needs strong men, will you join us patriots? 

If I was a Chink, I'd be posting about useless topics to keep you all distracted like professional sports, Black Lives Matter, and pornography.

Remember how Hunter Biden's nudes (with some very uh... young looking women) and methamphetamine pipe photographs got leaked? No? It was probably memory-holed from you ever seeing it. Blackmail is used often, including by the CCP. They own the current administration.

MilitaryCelebratingLGBTPrideMonth.jpg

Found General Chang

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, torqued said:

My argument has always been that the vaccine is not completely safe and that vaccine is not completely effective.

Evidence continues to leak through the massive propaganda wall that this vaccine is neither.

I LOL'd because it was obvious you don't understand the table. The denominator is already in the table. FIRST COLUMN. WTF? I continue to LOL because I can't believe I have to point this out

All Old People (>50) Delta COVID Deaths (Denominator) - 1644

Vaccinated (Numerator) - 1054

Unvaccinated (Numerator) - 437

You are trying to bury the evidence in "denominators of all old people deaths for all reasons" when the fact of the matter is the deaths in that table are being attributed to COVID. Yes, old people die of a lot of things. But these are all the deaths in the UK being attributed to COVID by a positive specimen test and after receiving a vaccine. If the people in your denominators were dying from other old people reasons, they wouldn't be recorded in the table. Why would any of them be recorded as dying of COVID if they are vaccinated, and at higher rates (in the same row) than unvaccinated? It is because the vaccine doesn't work as advertised?

Yes, I am arguing there is evidence to suggest the vaccine does not reduce the rates of hospitalization and death to the extent that it should be mandatory for everyone. Breakthrough infections. A outdated vaccine that was manufactured for the original genomic sequence and one that will continue to mutate even if 100% of the population receives this vaccine.

Somehow I get the impression no one in your SQ cares about your personal assessment of their character.

 

Wrong again. You aren't controlling for the total number of people in the vaccinated and unvaccinated sub groups. Your continuing arrogance in the face of being so objectively wrong is getting pretty obnoxious. 
 

When you calculate a death rate you divide deaths in a particular sub group by total number of people in that sub group. You do not divide a death number by another death number. That results in a unit-less proportion that has no context. We will now spell this out so there's no more confusion. 
 

When you want to find the total covid death rate you do this:

Number of covid deaths /  number of people 

So if you want the elderly vaccinated covid death rate you do this: 

number of vaxxed old people deaths / number of vaxxed old people

And if you want unvaxxed old people death rate you do this: 

number of unvaxxed old people deaths / number of unvaxxed old people


Hopefully by now you have caught on that there are two different denominators and one is much larger than the other. And that is why the death rate can be much lower for vaxxed old people despite their numerator being larger.
 

The only thing your mis-analysis allows you to say is that approximately two thirds of the UK elderly covid deaths are among vaccinated and one third are the unvaccinated. But without the correct denominators that number does not tell you anything useful about death rates and relative risk level between the two groups.


Quick thought experiment. If everyone had the shot, vaccinated people would account for 100% of the deaths! My goodness! The vaccine must be pointless! It's almost like having the correct denominator actually matters. 

Edited by Pooter
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

15 minutes ago, BrightNeptune said:

The latter. The mission broke me and I'm done. I've participated directly in ending many lives for no purpose. Those people could still be alive and there would be no difference. Who knows if they were even bad people. Showing up overhead just to waste a random dude that is no threat to you, your family, or your country takes it toll after you have been doing it for years on end.

You know the flashback scene in the third Bourne movie with Jason, his trainer, and a dude in the corner with a hood over his head and handcuffs? Jason was told to pick up the gun and shoot him. The trainer would not answer any questions. I picked up that gun and shot many people and watched them bleed out live and in high definition. I can't do that anymore. (No, I did not "fly" a drone, I was there overhead)

I'm pretty much at the end of my UPT ADSC and want out ASAP before these idiots in charge find a new way to sacrifice my life in order to give them a bullet on their next OPR.

I have yet to be convinced I need the vaccine, either. If I was a free man I would not get it until I am convinced that it will benefit me. I'm not a free man and there is now a gun to my head, so I guess I will be getting it shortly.
 

Damn. That's a hell of a burden you're carrying. But, you are a free man. Sounds like you need to close this chapter in your life. There is so much opportunity out there and I didn't realize it until I was out. As was said earlier, you're not the only one feeling this crisis of faith and trust, but maybe moreso than most. I hope you do whatever is right for you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Pooter said:

Wrong again. You aren't controlling for the total number of people in the vaccinated and unvaccinated sub groups. Your continuing arrogance in the face of being so objectively wrong is getting pretty obnoxious. 
 

When you calculate a death rate you divide deaths in a particular sub group by total number of people in that sub group. You do not divide a death number by another death number. That results in a unit-less proportion that has no context. We will now spell this out so there's no more confusion. 
 

When you want to find the total covid death rate you do this:

Number of covid deaths /  number of people 

So if you want the elderly vaccinated covid death rate you do this: 

number of vaxxed old people deaths / number of vaxxed old people

And if you want unvaxxed old people death rate you do this: 

number of unvaxxed old people deaths / number of unvaxxed old people


Hopefully by now you have caught on that there are two different denominators and one is much larger than the other. And that is why the death rate can be much lower for vaxxed old people despite their numerator being larger.
 

The only thing your mis-analysis allows you to say is that approximately two thirds of the UK elderly covid deaths are among vaccinated and one third are the unvaccinated. But without the correct denominators that number does not tell you anything useful about death rates and relative risk level between the two groups.


Quick thought experiment. If everyone had the shot, vaccinated people would account for 100% of the deaths! My goodness! The vaccine must be pointless! It's almost like having the correct denominator actually matters. 

Thanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

37 minutes ago, torqued said:

Damn. That's a hell of a burden you're carrying. But, you are a free man. Sounds like you need to close this chapter in your life. There is so much opportunity out there and I didn't realize it until I was out. As was said earlier, you're not the only one feeling this crisis of faith and trust, but maybe moreso than most. I hope you do whatever is right for you.

@BrightNeptune Get out. Live your life and do good. Consider getting involved somehow in local & state politics which are going to be the only reason our nation will survive. The federal government is totally subverted at this point. Don't let them win. (they're losing hard, that's why they're making so many mistakes currently)

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, BrightNeptune said:

The latter. The mission broke me and I'm done. I've participated directly in ending many lives for no purpose. Those people could still be alive and there would be no difference. Who knows if they were even bad people. Showing up overhead just to waste a random dude that is no threat to you, your family, or your country takes it toll after you have been doing it for years on end.

You know the flashback scene in the third Bourne movie with Jason, his trainer, and a dude in the corner with a hood over his head and handcuffs? Jason was told to pick up the gun and shoot him. The trainer would not answer any questions. I picked up that gun and shot many people and watched them bleed out live and in high definition. I can't do that anymore. (No, I did not "fly" a drone, I was there overhead

 

Happy to talk if you want to Dm me.  I know exactly what you feel, having done more of this than perhaps anyone in the AF.  But I would challenge a few of your assumptions.  The things you’ve done are not for nothing.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, BrightNeptune said:

The latter. The mission broke me and I'm done. I've participated directly in ending many lives for no purpose. Those people could still be alive and there would be no difference. Who knows if they were even bad people. Showing up overhead just to waste a random dude that is no threat to you, your family, or your country takes it toll after you have been doing it for years on end.

You know the flashback scene in the third Bourne movie with Jason, his trainer, and a dude in the corner with a hood over his head and handcuffs? Jason was told to pick up the gun and shoot him. The trainer would not answer any questions. I picked up that gun and shot many people and watched them bleed out live and in high definition. I can't do that anymore. (No, I did not "fly" a drone, I was there overhead)

I'm pretty much at the end of my UPT ADSC and want out ASAP before these idiots in charge find a new way to sacrifice my life in order to give them a bullet on their next OPR.

I have yet to be convinced I need the vaccine, either. If I was a free man I would not get it until I am convinced that it will benefit me. I'm not a free man and there is now a gun to my head, so I guess I will be getting it shortly.
 

Fair enough, as a mobility guy I can't say I directly understand your struggles; I have helped carry an unfortunate amount of dead American SOF off the back of my airplane over the years and I'd be lying if I said that the last three weeks of events in Afghanistan have been easy for me to process either.  If you ever need someone to vent to please feel free to DM, I sincerely wish you the best wherever you land.  

  Unsolicited advice that you're free to disregard/ignore; don't end your time in the AF on a General or other than honorable discharge.  I think you'd regret it in the long run.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Lord Ratner said:

Found General Chang

It helps a lot to go under user settings and just block seeing his posts; keeps all these threads more coherent.  Also, if I could ask a favor, try not to quote that Martian, it complicates my own efforts to not see the garbage he posts.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, pawnman said:

Chang was annoying, but at least he was coherent. 

>calls my posts incoherent because you’re too much of a mentally deficient loser to actually debate me and win

Why @pawnman “con”man?

Does anyone know if @DirkDiggler has Ligma? He can’t seem to ever stop talking about me.

Edited by dogfish78
Link to comment
Share on other sites

At what point will the mods boot someone based on a large number of active members blocking all of their content?

That’s not a spear at the mods, it’s an actual question. What percent of active daily membership have to block someone before the troll gets bounced?

Edited by Boomer6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...