Jump to content

COVID-19 (Aka China Virus)


Orbit

Recommended Posts

I'm not pro or anti  VAX but I have questions on the VAX.  This vax was available for testing within like 4 months of the pandemic.  After like 6 months it was the silver bullet vs Covid.  But now there are ppl that have the vax and being hospitalized.  Jesse Jackson and his wife, Oscar De la Hoya just to name a few celebs.  There are many other break through cases.  We really dont know what the make up of hospitalizations is because there is a good chance they will never admit how many breakthrough hospitalizations there are because then they lost all credibility.  (not like we haven't been lied to before, Vietnam, Iraq, AFG, etc....)My 38 yr old healthy cousin is vaxed but still got pretty sick, not hospitalized.  Most likely same symptoms vaxed or not.  Now they are calling for boosters cuz the vax wears off.  The US is in the 2nd highest case peak and climbing last i checked.  Maybe, just maybe this vaccine sucks and they didn't have adequate time to really test it?  Bring these questions up to a hard left pro vaxer and you basically get labeled as a racist deplorable trump supporter.  There is literally no conversation.  Just look at this thread.  

 

The position I am currently in is that my odds are low of dying of Covid.  The VAX may or may not reduce my chance of hospitalization but even that my odds are still low of requiring a bed.  I am not confident what the long term effects of hte vaccine are at this point.  I am aware I will most likely need the vaccine to continue my job in hte civilian sector.

 

Side note:  We have an office in Calgary.  Im pretty close with a guy there and I asked a while ago why Canada is so crazy over shut downs.  Apparently they only have 250 ICU beds in Alberta which is like 4.5mm ppl.  Compare that to my state of CO where we have like 2k....makes you glad you dont have govt run health care and makes sense if that is the case in Australia why they are freakign out over 5 cases.  They simply pissed away tax payer money vs building the health care infrastructure.

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I view vaccine mandates the same as drug use and testing. A company is completely within their rights as a private company to randomly test employees for liver enzymes to detect excessive alcohol consumption, and fire you if you drink too much.

What company has done this?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, FLEA said:

Nope. I want protected from polio. Polio sucks and if I got it, it would probably kill me. It's necessary for my survival to inoculate against it, especially since it's still widespread in many countries the US operates in. 

If I am a recovered COVID patient, you can't make the same argument for necessity. I am likely already possessing immunity equal to one greater than what the vaccine alone can provide. The vaccine isn't necessary to save my life or protect me in anyway. 

But if you have the shot, why does it matter if school kids get it?  You're protected, right?  Why the mandates for public school children to get vaccinated for polio, measles, mumps, rubella...I mean, those kill fewer people than Covid has every year, why the mandates?

Link to comment
Share on other sites






Physical hospital space and available beds is one problem, and that's an easier problem to solve because you can throw money at it to fix it. Staying and patient loads are a bigger problem.

I mean, it's not like it doesn't take years to create doctors and nurses to staff those hospitals (as well as everything else medical related such as clinics and nursing homes), and the pipeline (particularly for doctors) is already maxed out.

It's like the AF pilot retention problem, except doctors don't have an ADSC and there's no real way to increase the production of doctors in a year like the AF can with pilots.
The other issue is that COVID is driving a lot of hospitals into bankruptcy. They don't make as much money treating COVID patients as they do performing elective surgeries (many of which they've had to postpone because of COVID). The government gives them $40k every time they put someone on a ventilator, but it still doesn't compare to the triple bypasses they could be doing.
  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, CaptainMorgan said:


What company has done this?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Busch Gardens Director level positions, at a minimum, but that was as of 2008. Many tech companies in the Bay Area also test for “excessive alcohol use,” but again that’s for higher level positions that risk more embarrassment than entry level workers. Do I know of anyone being fired for that? No.

Edited by LumberjackAxe
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Busch Gardens Director level positions, at a minimum, but that was as of 2008. Many tech companies in the Bay Area also test for “excessive alcohol use,” but again that’s for higher level positions that risk more embarrassment than entry level workers. Do I know of anyone being fired for that? No.

That makes zero sense and seems like it could result in some serious liability should an employee/potential employee decide to sue. A liver enzyme test can determine whether someone drinks or doesn’t. It’s accuracy on gauging how much some one drinks is zero. There are way too many factors to discern that through such a test. Also, who the hell wants to work for Busch gardens, and what sort of hypocrisy are we in that Busch gardens wants to make sure their employees are sober?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, pawnman said:

But if you have the shot, why does it matter if school kids get it?  You're protected, right?  Why the mandates for public school children to get vaccinated for polio, measles, mumps, rubella...I mean, those kill fewer people than Covid has every year, why the mandates?

Wtf are you talking about dude? Do you even know anymore? 

  • Like 3
  • Downvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, FLEA said:

Wtf are you talking about dude? Do you even know anymore? 

Oh, the argument only works for Covid, not polio?

Where is your cutoff for vaccines that should be required vs ones that shouldn't be?

  • Downvote 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 hours ago, pawnman said:

Same reason they make you get the flu shot every year even though relatively few people die of the flu - because if you're sick in bed at home for a week with the flu, that's a week you aren't getting in the cockpit.

Ahh, but there in lies the problem. You are assuming that maintenance is producing enough jets for us to get into the cockpit on a weekly basis. 😆 

  • Haha 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, pawnman said:

Oh, the argument only works for Covid, not polio?

Where is your cutoff for vaccines that should be required vs ones that shouldn't be?

Dude we are talking about the medical neccesity of vaccinating people who have already recovered from COVID. This has nothing to do with polio or children. Your arguments make no sense. 

  • Like 2
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, FLEA said:

Dude we are talking about the medical neccesity of vaccinating people who have already recovered from COVID. This has nothing to do with polio or children. Your arguments make no sense. 

Yes, yes, we know that you oppose vaccinations in spite of a wealth of data.

Any argument in favor of vaccines won't make sense to you.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Pawnman serious question….what’s your goal end state look like?

copy you want to vaccinate everyone, but what’s next? Any thoughts on people who still catch COVID after taking the shot?

also, were you triggered by the full college football stadiums this weekend? 
don’t worry Chicago public health “experts” said lollapalooza didn’t spread the virus so I’m sure stadiums are safe as well. 
 

69C052D3-8DE0-430F-966F-87ACF387E4A3.png

B1867061-EDAD-4975-A0BF-013912519148.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Yes, yes, we know that you oppose vaccinations in spite of a wealth of data.

Any argument in favor of vaccines won't make sense to you.

Equating polio with COVID is apples to oranges. It’s a non starter for your argument. 

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 minutes ago, BashiChuni said:

Equating polio with COVID is apples to oranges. It’s a non starter for your argument. 

Right...public health protections that use vaccines to reduce risk are entirely incomparable.

Just like seat belts and traffic laws.

The only thing that matters is not taking the Covid vaccine for some reason, after taking a half dozen other vaccines.

I don't have any more arguments for you.  The vaccines reduce the spread.  The vaccines reduce the severity.  The vaccines have a very low rate of side-effects.  I don't have any new arguments for you.  The data has been cited over a dozen times in this thread alone.

Get the vaccines or don't, I don't care.  But if you don't get them, then you're probably gonna be hunting for a new job, and most of the airlines are also pushing people to get vaccines or have some kind of consequences.  The entire federal government is following the DoD's lead on mandatory vaccines.  So...maybe start your own anti-vaxx t-shirt company?

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

16 minutes ago, HeloDude said:

I’m still waiting for motorcycles to be banned…you know, for public safety.

Why are you bringing up motorcycles in the thread about Covid vaccines?

Equating motorcycles to Covid is apples and oranges...to borrow your phrase.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Polio/TB: much much worse than COVID.

Measle/Mumps/Rubella/Chickenpox:  Not nearly as bad as COVID normally, disproportionately affects kids however.

A COVID vaccine requirement for public schools/military, is perfectly in line with normal practice in America.

Mandatory vaccines generally is less common.  Smallpox the last time?  I honestly don't know.

 

Question for the "anti-vaxxers," something I've been thinking about a bit:

If the Faucis of the world had been completely transparent instead of shaping their comments to the public to get a desired behavior.  If the politicians hadn't been completely hypocritical.  If the public had reimbursed businesses for loss due to public action.         Etc.  

Would you be as vehemently against the vaccine?  a mandate?

In other words, how much of your position is based on "not one more fucking inch" vs opposition to this specific thing?

Being honest with myself, I don't think I would have sneezed if all that went away, and this was solely about a mandatory, free vaccine.

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 minutes ago, pawnman said:

Why are you bringing up motorcycles in the thread about Covid vaccines?

Equating motorcycles to Covid is apples and oranges...to borrow your phrase.

If you think COVID and polio have the same risk factors for children then you’re an idiot. I’m sorry but you are. 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, pawnman said:

Yes, yes, we know that you oppose vaccinations in spite of a wealth of data.

Any argument in favor of vaccines won't make sense to you.

But I'm not.... So you apparently are unable to follow what's going on. 

I have every vaccine in the DoD inventory, including COVID which I got in February of 21. (One of the earliest) I'm making a stand on ethics and morality and you are simply stuck in a black and white worldview thats selfishly interested in removing bodily autonomy from everyone else so you can go about a normal life again. Get over yourself bro. 

  • Like 1
  • Upvote 4
  • Downvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

34 minutes ago, McJay Pilot said:

So... after 102 pages of discussion and back and forth... does using a seatbelt increase or decrease my odds of getting COVID?

You use a seatbelt?  How can you let the government compromise your autonomy like that?  So few people die in car accidents, seat belts don't even help anyway...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, busdriver said:

Polio/TB: much much worse than COVID.

Measle/Mumps/Rubella/Chickenpox:  Not nearly as bad as COVID normally, disproportionately affects kids however.

A COVID vaccine requirement for public schools/military, is perfectly in line with normal practice in America.

Mandatory vaccines generally is less common.  Smallpox the last time?  I honestly don't know.

 

Question for the "anti-vaxxers," something I've been thinking about a bit:

If the Faucis of the world had been completely transparent instead of shaping their comments to the public to get a desired behavior.  If the politicians hadn't been completely hypocritical.  If the public had reimbursed businesses for loss due to public action.         Etc.  

Would you be as vehemently against the vaccine?  a mandate?

In other words, how much of your position is based on "not one more fucking inch" vs opposition to this specific thing?

Being honest with myself, I don't think I would have sneezed if all that went away, and this was solely about a mandatory, free vaccine.

Shack. I'm vaccinated, but I'm completely against the mandatory programs because once your leaders demonstrate they are perfectly comfortable lying to you, trusting them is foolish. 

 

We still don't have hard numbers for ending lockdowns and mask mandates after 20 MONTHS! Really? You have to be intentionally blind to think there's a plan. There isn't. Just like the military, the people who desire and achieve leadership positions in government bureaucracies are largely incapable of operating in an unfamiliar situation. Our system prioritizes individual liberty because the incompetence of leaders in large organizations is an old and persistent phenomenon. 

 

Just look at the totality of the pandemic, not just the mandates you like or the actions that made sense, but the whole timeline, and tell me you want more government control over our lives.

No thanks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I’m perpetuating some shitty internet practices right now, but Sam Harris had an excellent podcast on this topic (http://samharris.org/subscriber-rss/?uid=109560) and his guest brought up a curious point: that even if you take the worst-case scenario numbers of adverse events from the vaccine (these numbers not coming from the CDC, but from anti-vax sources), and then compare that risk to the risk of an adverse reaction to COVID-19, then it’s still a no brainer to get the vaccine.

 

I know the thread has veered toward whether a mandate is good or not, but what do folks think about comparing the risk of getting COVID/hospitalization, versus the an adverse vaccine reaction? Is it even possible?

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

22 minutes ago, LumberjackAxe said:

I’m perpetuating some shitty internet practices right now, but Sam Harris had an excellent podcast on this topic (http://samharris.org/subscriber-rss/?uid=109560) and his guest brought up a curious point: that even if you take the worst-case scenario numbers of adverse events from the vaccine (these numbers not coming from the CDC, but from anti-vax sources), and then compare that risk to the risk of an adverse reaction to COVID-19, then it’s still a no brainer to get the vaccine.

 

I know the thread has veered toward whether a mandate is good or not, but what do folks think about comparing the risk of getting COVID/hospitalization, versus the an adverse vaccine reaction? Is it even possible?

Bingo!

  • Like 1
  • Thanks 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...