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20 minutes ago, AlphaMikeFoxtrot said:

Example, is there truth that if hired by SkyWest you cannot jump ship for United before 5 years of employment?

No. I am not aware of this anywhere in the US. 
 

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10 hours ago, AlphaMikeFoxtrot said:

Can anyone shed some light on which regionals/pilot union may preclude someone from terminating regional employment and transitioning to another large carrier? Example, is there truth that if hired by SkyWest you cannot jump ship for United before 5 years of employment?

I’ll ask some of my regional buddies, but I think the confusion may stem from any bonuses given. I.e., Skywest gives former helo dudes up to 25k for pilot training to ATP, and I highly doubt they’d be cool with you just leaving after 6 months if a major came calling (unlikely I know, but just an example). I would assume like anything, it depends on the contract.

Contrast that with a former Navy O-5 I know. He spent his last three years in the Navy at a desk, so he went to the regionals. He was a F-18 driver so he spent about 7 months there, got current, and got hired on at a major. 

Edited by Bigred
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I’ll ask some of my regional buddies, but I think the confusion may stem from any bonuses given. I.e., Skywest gives former helo dudes up to 25k for pilot training to ATP, and I highly doubt they’d be cool with you just leaving after 6 months if a major came calling (unlikely I know, but just an example). I would assume like anything, it depends on the contract.
Contrast that with a former Navy O-5 I know. He spent his last three years in the Navy at a desk, so he went to the regionals. He was a F-18 driver so he spent about 7 months there, got current, and got hired on at a major. 


Yeah man my situation is similar to your Navy buddy. School then staff now I’m seeking employment with no recency.

I’ve not heard any first hand stories of any transition issues but have heard about friends of friends that were denied employment due to regional employment. Just trying to find truth data. Not really a good question for HR.
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2 hours ago, AlphaMikeFoxtrot said:

 


Yeah man my situation is similar to your Navy buddy. School then staff now I’m seeking employment with no recency.

I’ve not heard any first hand stories of any transition issues but have heard about friends of friends that were denied employment due to regional employment. Just trying to find truth data. Not really a good question for HR.

I'd take those latter stories with a grain of salt. I haven't heard of anyone getting brought into an interview only to not get offered a job because they flew for a specific regional. However, I do know plenty of folks that never got invited to an interview. The most likely cause is that within the regional community, there's 10,000 dudes with the same exact resumé; it's difficult to make yourself stick out amongst that crowd. Yet, you'll hear guys say, "I haven't gotten a call from UAL because I work for XYZ." Nah, bro; you haven't gotten called because you're a copilot with 1,800 hours, no PIC time, and each airline still has 12,000 applications on file.

Probably the most important factor for you is going to a company that won't force you to commute. Also, not all bonuses come with strings attached. For a long while, bonuses at SkyWest didn't require you to sign any contracts. Don't know if that's still the case. PM if you need help with the process.

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Speaking of commuting, is it possible to start trips outside of your base? For example, if you’re based out of San Francisco but live in Anchorage, can you do the first leg of a trip from Anchorage to San Francisco or do all trips have to start in domicile?

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I don't understand how FedEx and UPS do their trips (which I hear is great if you want to commute), but where I work, you will start out of your domicile with 2 exceptions:

1.  If a trip comes available for the next day at another domicile, you can grab it from Open Time.  I see this with pilots that live near a senior base, but cannot get domiciled there because they are still too junior.  

2.  It's rare, but sometimes a trip will begin with a deadhead from your domicile to the city you live in.  You grab the trip, skip (and get paid) for the deadhead, and show up to your local airport in time for next leg.  

It's been said a thousand times before... but if you choose to commute rather than live in domicile, you forfeit a significant benefit to being an airline pilot.  For the record, I commuted for 18 months from San Antonio to Chicago.  

Edited by HuggyU2
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I don't understand how FedEx and UPS do their trips (which I hear is great if you want to commute), but where I work, you will start out of your domicile with 2 exceptions:
1.  If a trip comes available for the next day at another domicile, you can grab it from Open Time.  I see this with pilots that live near a senior base, but cannot get domiciled there because they are still too junior.  
2.  It's rare, but sometimes a trip will begin with a deadhead from your domicile to the city you live in.  You grab the trip, skip (and get paid) for the deadhead, and show up to your local airport in time for next leg.  
It's been said a thousand times before... but if you choose to commute rather than live in domicile, you forfeit a significant benefit to being an airline pilot.  For the record, I commuted for 18 months from San Antonio to Chicago.  
I will beat the dead horse to death about how great it is to be within a 30-45 min car drive from my base. It just leaves you with so many more options. Bid a line, bid Reserve, grab OG, grab premium, etc. Or of course you can sit back on LCR for 73 hrs month and never work. I have worked 3 days on short call this month so far.
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5 hours ago, HuggyU2 said:

I don't understand how FedEx and UPS do their trips (which I hear is great if you want to commute), but where I work, you will start out of your domicile with 2 exceptions:

1.  If a trip comes available for the next day at another domicile, you can grab it from Open Time.  I see this with pilots that live near a senior base, but cannot get domiciled there because they are still too junior.  

2.  It's rare, but sometimes a trip will begin with a deadhead from your domicile to the city you live in.  You grab the trip, skip (and get paid) for the deadhead, and show up to your local airport in time for next leg. 

Your #2 above is basically how FedEx constructs a large percentage of their trips.  The same deadhead from "domicile to the city you live in" scenario you describe is exactly how many of our pilots go to work on their trips.  The additional wrinkle to any of our deadhead trips is that if you deviate and do not use the scheduled deadhead flights from domicile, the money from those tickets is yours to use to get where you need to go.  Those not quite as fortunate to be able to hold deadheads to their actual home city, avoid the classic commute to domicile on their free time by using the money to fly from home to the city in which they begin their trip.  Usually they are doing that during the "footprint" of their trip which incorporates the time spent deadheading from base.  A paid commute on company time in most cases while accruing airline FF miles and the benefits that come with those.  The FedEx contract does not allow us to be positioned for work on our own aircraft jump seats except under rare circumstances.  Last I knew, that was not the case with UPS.  They make more use of their own aircraft to move their pilots which isn't going to allow the same level of flexibility.

While not as good as living in domicile, it's so much better than a classic pax airline commute.  Definitely a better option for some of  us than holding our nose and moving the the suburbs of Memphis.  Fortunately, most of the major pax airlines guys hope to land a job with have better options for domicile cities and if circumstances allow moving, driving to work is the best.

I just relocated to Hong Kong in conjunction with a move to the left seat.  First time in 14 years that I'm living in domicile.  While not quite the same as driving from the DFW or ATL suburbs (I don't have a car here), it's nice to worry less about getting to work.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Referencing HossHarris website post, definitely interesting data points. Something we’ve been watching as one of the hired guns for Amazon for quite some time now. FedEx has thrown some hurdles and speed bumps in front of them, it was just a matter of timing before a wrench was thrown back. Business is war, and the Fred vs Bezos show has quite the history dating back many years.

Unsure what the future may bring, but the facility construction in CVG is well underway and judging by the footprint of phase I, FedEx and UPS will take/have taken notice and planned accordingly/or may not be able too. Visibly, it’s just scratching the surface what lies ahead. We’re just contracted and if gobbled up during the expansion, Bezos doesn’t take prisoners which is worrisome at best. What happens when we’re all assimilated???

————————————————————————————————————

***Regarding the Domicile info. Totally agree, nothing compares to being in Domicile convenience wise or at least being near your Guard unit. 

**Having retired from the Guard over 2 years ago, I have moved 3 times just trying to figure out where it feels right to actually settle down for awhile. Domicile living is exceptional if it is really where you want to be. It does conjure up old AF assignments memories you didn’t want due to the location you were in. 

*Domicile matters somewhat, but not as important as our company provides ticketing to our Domicile or wherever they need us (you keep the points). You may lose a day here or there (Lost 1 last year, but I normally bid lines where commute days count as work days), but nothing like having to commute with no responsibility whatsoever. Aircraft maintenance issues, weather delays, airline cancels, etc. matter not, not my problem. Before I started the airline gig, a Delta friend let me know - “Getting to work is half the pressure of doing your dang job!!!” I really appreciate no crash pad, airport car or stranger room mates. And while the company still exists, it’s nice not having to relive college in the aforementioned scenario and touring the world.

BONUS: I cannot recall/witnessing a time where a pilot could choose where they want to live first, and then get hired by an airline that supports it. Carry on and Fly on!

Edited by AirGuardianC141747
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Starting to work on my airline applications and was looking for some recommendations for books and resources to help with the application and interview process.

Are the following books worthwhile to buy?

Cockpit 2 Cockpit 

Everything Explained for the Professional Pilot

Checklist for success: A pilot’s guide to the successful airline interview 

 

Would you recommend Milkeep to help convert my hours?

Any specific recommendations for application review and interview prep companies?

Any other advice in getting started?
 

Thanks!

 

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Starting to work on my airline applications and was looking for some recommendations for books and resources to help with the application and interview process.
Are the following books worthwhile to buy?
Cockpit 2 Cockpit 
Everything Explained for the Professional Pilot
Checklist for success: A pilot’s guide to the successful airline interview 
 
Would you recommend Milkeep to help convert my hours?
Any specific recommendations for application review and interview prep companies?
Any other advice in getting started?
 
Thanks!
 
You are going to get a lot of different recommendations but here's my personal take.

Hours: DIY with Excel, or use MilKeep
Light Reading: What you said
App Review: CheckedandSet (buy the combo with Emerald Coast) use Charlie, the others I've heard mixed reviews. They'll review two apps, pick your two favorites that are on two different sites (AKA NOT United and Delta)
Resume Prep: personally had a bad experience with Career Takeoff, used CockpittoCockpit template instead
Interview Prep: Emerald Coast, lifetime membership. Great for general prep.

All this said, other companies offer resume, app, and interview prep all in one package. Most of those are focused on one airline or another so if you have a favorite use those. I wanted American and did not hear about Judy Tarver (AA focus) until I had already completed Emerald Coast prep. Again, lots of opinions inbound but this set up worked for me (CJO and starting with AA on the 21st).

Sent from my SM-G960U using Baseops Network mobile app

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I highly recommend Cockpit to Cockpit.  It serves as a great checklist when you're starting to get your apps together and prep for interviews. 

Milkeep was worth its weight in gold.  I went the Excel route originally, but inputting 3000 hours line by line pushed me to my breaking point.  Best $200 I've ever spent.

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.”I have worked 3 days on short call this month so far.”

Folks, unless you value your time at zero, please stop saying this. If you are required to be within a certain geographic radius, fit for flying duty and contactable....you are working. Don’t sell yourself and your profession short. 

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.”I have worked 3 days on short call this month so far.”
Folks, unless you value your time at zero, please stop saying this. If you are required to be within a certain geographic radius, fit for flying duty and contactable....you are working. Don’t sell yourself and your profession short. 
I've run into a few folks that take issue with these kinds of statements and can never figure out why. It is a valid data point for making a decision on whether to commute or not. Are you concerned that mgmt. or some layperson are going to read this and conclude that we are not working enough? Because I'm sure that the poster values his or her time as much as you or I do.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

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2 hours ago, Termy said:

.”I have worked 3 days on short call this month so far.”

Folks, unless you value your time at zero, please stop saying this. If you are required to be within a certain geographic radius, fit for flying duty and contactable....you are working. Don’t sell yourself and your profession short. 

If I can be at home, drunk, poking the frau, while shooting fireworks .... or fishing in the gulf .... then it’s not really work. 

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15 hours ago, HossHarris said:

If I can be at home, drunk, poking the frau, while shooting fireworks .... or fishing in the gulf .... then it’s not really work. 

Hell, I'll even fly my cub around on short call...still get a cell signal at 500 feet. 🤣  On short call, unless I leave my house, I don't even shower and shave anymore.  I do get Termy's gist...how about we just recognize days on duty (worked) vs days we actually put on a uniform.  

 

13 hours ago, MooseAg03 said:

You can be drunk on reserve? Sign me up!

Fo sho!  I'm on reserve and I spent the afternoon with a few squadronmates, wrenching in the garage and having beers...we're all 3 on reserve today.  Just got home and about to crack a bottle of wine for dinner.  In base, reserve life doesn't suck.

Edited by SocialD
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54 minutes ago, SocialD said:

In base, reserve life doesn't suck.

For all the gonnabe's out there looking over the fence at the greener grass, those first two words are mucho important.  The grass is still greener even if you wanna move back home to your farm in central KS, but most of the epic tales are from guys living in base.

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12 hours ago, HossHarris said:

Or at least relatively close. Atlanta sucks. The panhandle of Florida is awesome and close enough. 

Bite your tongue, after 20+ in the Air Force actively avoiding it,  I finally live in "base housing"--and it's awesome.  As a bonus, driving to work is priceless.

To each his own--another great facet of airline life.

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For Sputnik - Got it, makes sense not living in someone else’s shoes. I need to give some back ground info that pertains to my situation specifically.

Skip to the bottom for the quick answer and avoid the personal fluff below. See ***

Note:
*If your a Guard baby from the beginning and have never left your hometown/state OR have visited areas you would like to retire in than it’s probably easy to figure out where you want to live since Uncle Sam probably deployed you, but never really PCS’d/moved you. Or, you have kids in school and it doesn’t make sense to uproot yet again, etc. kind of a no brainer. Having Friends and Family nearby since birth is a luxury and I envy this position  - granted, that’s based upon great friends and good family members of course in a good location. It’s all eye of the beholder of course.

As for me:

Consider yourself fully retired having served over 24 years of military service in the active duty AND Guard or Reserve Components.

Moved 9 times fulfilling 9 assignments in 6 of our great states. Lived overseas during my younger (high school) years. Have family in Europe and the Far East.

No real responsibilities such as kids, schools, universities grandparents, parents, spouse employment etc. tying my wife and I down.

Our immediate families live in NOT so nice areas, basically a lot of America has changed these past few decades as it always has and not always for the better. 

Company I work for has domiciles, but we also have the option to commute (paid ticket) and hotel waiting for you prior to launch if you will. It’s a huge plus as we can pretty much live anywhere in the US and quite a few of our folks live overseas. May cost you a day commuting, but you get to live where you want. If you call HOME places like New York City, Chicago, Los Angeles, Seattle, Miami, etc (some of our domiciles) then it’s a perfect situation no doubt.

***I retired from Pan Handle of FL which was very nice and we moved to TN (1st move) summer of 2017, then moved to Atlantic side of FL summer of 2018 (2nd move), pulled chocks after 6 months and right back to TN to a familiar area for now.

Bottom Line: Uncle Sam has told us where to live for a very long time. Most people live where their jobs/livelihood/family thrives or have anchors they cannot break. We are blessed to be able to live almost anywhere (no complaints). Despite the cost/headaches, we have been striking out in search of somewhere we can settle down comfortably which meets our particular needs. Our Home towns of decades ago are no longer what we consider a great town today. While definitely not my hometown - I graduated from San Jose State University and thrived in “The City” (San Francisco) 89-93. How does “The City” look now? Never will return to the Left Coast.

Definitely <1st world problems and not a bad one to have if you can afford it. It’s probably a quick an easy answer for most, but it’s been perplexing at best. We’re still in the hunt for what we can only answer!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by AirGuardianC141747
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