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6 minutes ago, tac airlifter said:

You’re smarter than this.................  I see zero equivalence between him and AOC other than a bent towards showmanship.

That bent towards bloviating showmanship is exactly what I was talking about.  Their presence on the political stage, not what they have or haven't accomplished in their lives.

He vomited out stupid shit constantly.  The most comical was the sharpie modification of the hurricane thing, at least that was my favorite.  90% of of the stupid bullshit, people on the right just ignored.  "Trump's just bullshitting" sort of response.  At least that's my response.  

I have to think there is a similar thing going on, on the left.  She opens her mouth and I get pissed off.  But that's the same response on the left when Trump opens his mouth.

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11 hours ago, dream big said:

Policy

-Green New Deal

- running Amazon out of NYC costing her constituents 25k jobs

- wants to eliminate Border Patrol, supports open borders

- supports defunding the police

- anti second amendment

-claiming Billionaires shouldn’t exist/her radical tax ideology

 

11 hours ago, dream big said:

Not Really Policy?

- comparing combating climate change to fighting the nazis

-not understanding how unemployment works (thinking unemployment is so low due to people working two jobs)

-accusing Ted Cruz of trying to murder her for the Jan 6 spectacle which didn’t even occur in her building

-comparing southern border detention centers to nazi concentration camps (those “cages” still exist but Democrats are in power now so, nothing to see here)

-claims it is okay to spread misinformation as long as she is “morally right”.  Want us to go on?

 

 

 

 

Quote

Expressing Anger/Resentment

- The fact she got re-elected (over a Jamaican Republican businesswoman as her republican contender) tells me everything I need to know about the people in Queens and why it’s the armpit of America.  She sucks, and so does the rest of the “squad”. Zero sympathy for her.

 

Thanks for sharing. If you have more to add, please do.

I see 3 distinct groupings of information you shared, the first is clear policies you are against, the second is not exactly policy (maybe you can clarify here?), and the third is an expression of anger. My question to you would be, how do the policies you listed (#1) negatively affect you personally? 

And, what policies do you support instead of each of the points you listed in section #1?

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11 hours ago, Random Guy said:

 

 

 

Thanks for sharing. If you have more to add, please do.

I see 3 distinct groupings of information you shared, the first is clear policies you are against, the second is not exactly policy (maybe you can clarify here?), and the third is an expression of anger. My question to you would be, how do the policies you listed (#1) negatively affect you personally? 

And, what policies do you support instead of each of the points you listed in section #1?

They don’t affect me personally, but I love this country, its foundations and the constitution - and I don’t want the dumpster fire that is her district to become mainstream American. 

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11 hours ago, Random Guy said:

My question to you would be, how do the policies you listed (#1) negatively affect you personally? 

And, what policies do you support instead of each of the points you listed in section #1?

Because every wild left fringe idea right now will be a mainstream democrat view in 5 years, and probably policy soon thereafter. The constant crusade to be ever more progressive dictates that they always have to out-do their past selves to continue to attain virtue.  AOC is the foreshadowing of where the left is going to try to drag the Overton window.  So maybe it's worth debating the garbage ideas now, before they take hold and cause real damage. 
 

Maybe right now we can chalk up The green new deal and other AOC proposed crap as some pie in the sky nonsense from a juvenile queens bartender/tik tok star. But come find me in five years when we've tanked the economy (further) in the quest for a racially equitable climate justice utopia. Then it will be very apparent exactly which of her policy prescriptions negatively affect you personally. 

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1 hour ago, dream big said:

They don’t affect me personally, but I love this country, its foundations and the constitution - and I don’t want the dumpster fire that is her district to become mainstream American. 

Ok, just to be clear, the listed policies that you disagree with do not have any personal impact on you. Do you want to prevent someone who lives at a distance from you from creating policies relevant to their community, in other words, impose your will upon them? 

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54 minutes ago, Pooter said:

Because every wild left fringe idea right now will be a mainstream democrat view in 5 years, and probably policy soon thereafter. The constant crusade to be ever more progressive dictates that they always have to out-do their past selves to continue to attain virtue.  AOC is the foreshadowing of where the left is going to try to drag the Overton window.  So maybe it's worth debating the garbage ideas now, before they take hold and cause real damage. 
 

Maybe right now we can chalk up The green new deal and other AOC proposed crap as some pie in the sky nonsense from a juvenile queens bartender/tik tok star. But come find me in five years when we've tanked the economy (further) in the quest for a racially equitable climate justice utopia. Then it will be very apparent exactly which of her policy prescriptions negatively affect you personally. 

Which ideas, can you list a few?

When you say 'The economy will tank in 5 years', can you be specific about what that means? Ex: unemployment is 8-9%, stagnant or decreasing [real] wages, increasing reliance on imports, reduced mortality and birth rates, ?  

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2 hours ago, Random Guy said:

Ok, just to be clear, the listed policies that you disagree with do not have any personal impact on you. Do you want to prevent someone who lives at a distance from you from creating policies relevant to their community, in other words, impose your will upon them? 

I couldn’t care less what Queens does within their bubble, but as Pooter pointed out, these ideas are becoming more mainstream and pervasive across the nation. That’s the real problem… it’s important for those who reside in between the extremes of this country to call this BS out and eliminate it from any adult conversation on policy. 

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23 hours ago, tac airlifter said:

You’re smarter than this.

Has she built multi-million dollar businesses?  Did she expose actual corruption within our government?  Has the media aligned against her to blow every comment out of proportion and take each glib remark out of context?  Has anyone won a Pulitzer for spreading lies about her?

AOC is a radical revolutionary with niche appeal intent on tearing down this country.  Say what you will about Trump and his off-putting mannerisms, but the man has statistically significant voter appeal and leads a political movement based on prioritizing American security, energy independence, and economic growth, all while facing historically unprecedented resistance from a media-government inner circle.  I see zero equivalence between him and AOC other than a bent towards showmanship.

This is laughable. He’s a washed up mail order steak salesman who cares about nothing aside from his own self interest. Any argument that he gave two shits about our country has been blatantly dispelled over the last few weeks. The man wipes his ass with our constitution & the Republican Party needs to ditch him faster than a cheap prostitute. I’m not an AOC fan either, but say what you will about the Dems, I don’t see them nominating her for president any time soon. Rs now have the unfortunate reputation of really and truly letting their loons run the party. 

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9 hours ago, Random Guy said:

Ok, just to be clear, the listed policies that you disagree with do not have any personal impact on you. Do you want to prevent someone who lives at a distance from you from creating policies relevant to their community, in other words, impose your will upon them? 

She's a US Congresswoman. Policies she puts forward affect me as a US citizen. I'm in the community she has influence over - the US.

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5 hours ago, slc said:

Exactly.  Been to Portland/Seattle/SFO/LA/Denver lately?  

I've been to all of those places except Portland relatively recently and they were all really nice! Millions & millions of people live just within the city limits of those places. Literally ~6.9m people, I ran the numbers lol.

I've never lived in any of those cities, but the city I do live in/near is also nice!

Some folks are just overly negative about life in general and especially places where they aren't from and where people from the "other group" like to go. e.g. right-wingers think they hate NYC/SFO, left-wingers think they hate "flyover country," etc. Both NYC/SFO and "flyover states" can be really nice depending on what you're looking for.

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On 7/24/2022 at 8:43 AM, Random Guy said:

No need to be so sensitive, or try to draw people into political circles that may not be relevant.

Dude I get why people think you're a bot. What part of my response was sensitive? That's a pretty wild assessment from someone who had to go back and delete an emotional attack.

 

On 7/24/2022 at 8:43 AM, Random Guy said:

Do you consider US democrats 'protesting' at times to be equivalent to 'Alex' shouting "U mah fav big booty latina!". It's tit-for-tat? (2)

Protesting at times? What alternate reality do you live in? Spend five seconds on YouTube and find the BLM protestors screaming at cops. Or how about the *two* attempted murders now of conservative political figures (Kavanaugh and the Republican NY governor candidate).

 

If you have a point, you're not making it well. 

 

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19 minutes ago, nsplayr said:

I've been to all of those places except Portland relatively recently and they were all really nice! Millions & millions of people live just within the city limits of those places. Literally ~6.9m people, I ran the numbers lol.

I've never lived in any of those cities, but the city I do live in/near is also nice!

Some folks are just overly negative about life in general and especially places where they aren't from and where people from the "other group" like to go. e.g. right-wingers think they hate NYC/SFO, left-wingers think they hate "flyover country," etc. Both NYC/SFO and "flyover states" can be really nice depending on what you're looking for.

 San Francisco is a tragedy. You're either wildly ignorant about what's happening or intentionally misrepresenting it.

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11 minutes ago, Lord Ratner said:

Dude I get why people think you're a bot. What part of my response was sensitive? That's a pretty wild assessment from someone who had to go back and delete an emotional attack.

 

Protesting at times? What alternate reality do you live in? Spend five seconds on YouTube and find the BLM protestors screaming at cops. Or how about the *two* attempted murders now of conservative political figures (Kavanaugh and the Republican NY governor candidate).

 

If you have a point, you're not making it well. 

 

Don't forget this one as well:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_baseball_shooting

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13 hours ago, Random Guy said:

Which ideas, can you list a few?

When you say 'The economy will tank in 5 years', can you be specific about what that means? Ex: unemployment is 8-9%, stagnant or decreasing [real] wages, increasing reliance on imports, reduced mortality and birth rates, ?  

Specifically relating to the green new deal: 

Policy: spending massive sums of taxpayer money to achieve climate equity. The idea being that climate change "disproportionally affects people of color and marginalized communities" (Read the bill it's in there) so we have to dump truckloads of government cash into said communities and green energy initiatives to achieve equity. 
 

Result:

-Skyrocketing energy costs making us uncompetitive with China, while also not solving the worldwide carbon emissions problem.

-Higher inflation due to government spending/skewing of the energy market

-Increased reliance on foreign oil. (How's that working out for Europe right now?) 

-Increased outsourcing of manufacturing jobs to countries without garbage climate policy.


So I've given you a few examples, care to expand on why you think her policies won't empirically hurt the economy while also doing nothing to solve climate change?

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3 hours ago, nsplayr said:

I've been to all of those places except Portland relatively recently and they were all really nice! Millions & millions of people live just within the city limits of those places. Literally ~6.9m people, I ran the numbers lol.

I've never lived in any of those cities, but the city I do live in/near is also nice!

Some folks are just overly negative about life in general and especially places where they aren't from and where people from the "other group" like to go. e.g. right-wingers think they hate NYC/SFO, left-wingers think they hate "flyover country," etc. Both NYC/SFO and "flyover states" can be really nice depending on what you're looking for.

I saw someone shit on the sidewalk within 3 hrs of arriving in SF earlier this year.

I was in LA for an overnight stay 2 years ago and saw more homeless people in 24 hours than I have seen cumulatively in the rest of my entire life including many years living in other major cities. 
 

There are very nice parts of California.  But those places are either very far from the cities, or near the cities and prohibitively expensive

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Oh now he and others are upset by what a bunch of us were already telling them…

https://apple.news/AD7zsvHxkS4a42WNVSFzHgg


It’s like they didn’t care if you were a good ally or a bad ally, because you’re really just a useful idiot to them Adam. But hey thanks for the help in what the real goal of all this lending your name to justice was, setting up their long term campaign plan because they never actually cared about that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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8 hours ago, nsplayr said:

I've been to all of those places except Portland relatively recently and they were all really nice! Millions & millions of people live just within the city limits of those places. Literally ~6.9m people, I ran the numbers lol.

I've never lived in any of those cities, but the city I do live in/near is also nice!

Some folks are just overly negative about life in general and especially places where they aren't from and where people from the "other group" like to go. e.g. right-wingers think they hate NYC/SFO, left-wingers think they hate "flyover country," etc. Both NYC/SFO and "flyover states" can be really nice depending on what you're looking for.

Anecdotal, but I was in Portland two weeks ago. Our copilot who was meeting us for dinner got spit on and chased by a homeless person. It was like playing frogger dodging all the tents and literal human pieces of shit to get back to our hotel.

Also, literally just got back from SFO today and it wasn't as bad as Portland, but still tons of homeless everywhere and very dirty (granted, that might be the normal). Met up with one of my E's for dinner who moved there and he told me he sold his car so it would no longer be broken into (among other reasons). Ironically, my rental car got broken into last year at Fisherman's Wharf and all my personnel belongings taken (to avoid victim blaming: they were in the trunk, nothing in plain sight).

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14 hours ago, slc said:

Exactly.  Been to Portland/Seattle/SFO/LA/Denver lately?  

do you mean the home of the Stanley Cup champions Colorado Avalanche? put some respeck on the name 🍻

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1 hour ago, StoleIt said:

Anecdotal, but I was in Portland two weeks ago. 

It depends a lot on where in the city you are.  I was there about a month ago, stayed in the Northwest district.  23rd street area was fine.  Walking down to Powell's city of books, there were more homeless folks/piss/etc.

Seattle up by the space needle was fine.  Walking down to pioneer square, the urine and puke aroma just kept getting stronger.

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1 hour ago, busdriver said:

It depends a lot on where in the city you are.  I was there about a month ago, stayed in the Northwest district.  23rd street area was fine.  Walking down to Powell's city of books, there were more homeless folks/piss/etc.

Seattle up by the space needle was fine.  Walking down to pioneer square, the urine and puke aroma just kept getting stronger.

It’s one of the things I miss about Tokyo.  You’ll not see a single homeless person, let alone feces, anywhere in the streets. It’s considered culturally shameful. The result is one of the cleanest and kept cities on the planet.  Meanwhile in America, homelessness and laziness is not only actively encouraged by a certain sect of our elected officials, it is embraced and enabled. 

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YES, homelessness in democratically controlled regions, such as California and Washington State, and large cities like SF, Portland, and Seattle have serious problems with inequality, employment, and asset prices. This is what [economic] liberalism produces. We are seeing the conclusion of 40 years of liberal [economic] policy pursued by both parties.

 

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21 hours ago, Pooter said:

Specifically relating to the green new deal: 

Policy: spending massive sums of taxpayer money to achieve climate equity. The idea being that climate change "disproportionally affects people of color and marginalized communities" (Read the bill it's in there) so we have to dump truckloads of government cash into said communities and green energy initiatives to achieve equity. 
 

Result:

-Skyrocketing energy costs making us uncompetitive with China, while also not solving the worldwide carbon emissions problem.

-Higher inflation due to government spending/skewing of the energy market

-Increased reliance on foreign oil. (How's that working out for Europe right now?) 

-Increased outsourcing of manufacturing jobs to countries without garbage climate policy.


So I've given you a few examples, care to expand on why you think her policies won't empirically hurt the economy while also doing nothing to solve climate change?

Ok, we're approaching our target I think. Taxpayer money, government spending beyond its means. Inflation, energy reliance/inflation.

Remember, I live in the EU, so I don't really care what domestic policies AOC (or anyone else) is proposing, it doesn't affect me. What I am trying to figure out is why people in the US are shouting the equivalent of 'Your my fav big booty Latina' over and over to one another, rather than holding a useful dialogue and trying to form a team. What are the real differences that are dividing people? Can you get a cross-dressing faggot and a gun-toting redneck onto the same team? What policies would that team be based on? Can a decentralized framework of 'live and let live given large open undeveloped geographic space' work? Or is it that we need to purge a large group of people in fire first, and there really is no alternative?

 

This leads us to prices--and we should really be over in the Finance thread, but I'll leave it here for now. First off, oil companies love high oil prices. US shale oil requires higher unit prices than almost anyone else, because the oil is more costly to extract. If you reduce oil prices below their costs, they close those wells. Generally, you need prices to be stable, and the Fed just gave the Dept of Energy to ability to act as 'shock absorber' via the futures market, guaranteeing future prices for oil producers. This ensures wells stay open and are less subject to speculative attack from outsiders like OPEC. Regarding Europe--remember that the US produces too much oil for its domestic market, and part of the conflict in Ukraine is about pushing the EU from Russian oil onto US natural gas. In other words, the US needs markets to sell its oil products, or the price of domestic oil crashes and the gov must absorb huge amounts via stockpiles (assuming it wants to keep domestic wells open). EU energy independence is bad for the US. More importantly however, is that energy transition to other sources (whatever they may be) requires energy. So exisiting energy production isn't going anywhere. What is going to have to change is the total level of consumption--we need to shift energy use from what we do now towards producing more energy sources that don't create GHG. If you don't think climate change is a thing, then you can ignore this (YOLO) and spend on something else. If you don't want the gov to spend on anything at all, do that.  

But this bring us to the actual topic at the heart of disagreement I think: HOW DO WE PAY FOR THINGS. And people get really worked up about this. But bankers don't. Bankers know they can always fund anything so long as the resources are available for purchase. 

Edited by Random Guy
added additional policy options
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8 hours ago, dream big said:

It’s one of the things I miss about Tokyo.  You’ll not see a single homeless person, let alone feces, anywhere in the streets. It’s considered culturally shameful. The result is one of the cleanest and kept cities on the planet.  Meanwhile in America, homelessness and laziness is not only actively encouraged by a certain sect of our elected officials, it is embraced and enabled. 

I think it’s more of the phase America went through that shut down insane asylums/mental health institutions.

 

Many of the homeless that would be committed/cared for are now on the streets.

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