Jaded Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 I know a viper bro who recently went to Accessible Aviation in Oakland. He had positive things to say. I think that a lot of their instructors are prior military. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Accessible Aviation in Oakland is relatively new and recently started up by Carl Nuzzo out of Golden Triangle Regional in MS. I expect about the same training and planes but at least you get your cert relatively easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerkStud Posted January 5, 2015 Share Posted January 5, 2015 Any one know of a military friendly place to knock out the ATP in the Long Island, NY area? If not in the northeast area? Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmacwc Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 Anyone tried the new system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HercDude Posted January 6, 2015 Share Posted January 6, 2015 ATP written complete as of last summer, but I haven't yet had time to do the ATP practical. I'm thinking mid-March of this year. Does anyone know of any great (and Mil-friendly) schools in the Western US? I'd like to knock it out during a long weekend, if able... I looked into Arizona Flight Training Center in Glendale, AZ last year and heard/read good things. They advertise a military-specific training program. I ended up going to a place in Kansas though, so can't speak to the quality of training at AZFTC. I'd imagine if you know anyone at Luke they can get you first-hand gouge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 From multiple guys I know who have done the ATP in the Phoenix area (not sure if it was AFT or another school nearby), I wouldn't go there. I can't speak to the program(s), but the area had at least one examiner de-certed recently so the remaining guys went full retard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ram Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 Good to know. Especially for examiners, but as a general rule: Never go full retard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goblin Posted January 7, 2015 Share Posted January 7, 2015 I looked into Arizona Flight Training Center in Glendale, AZ last year and heard/read good things. They advertise a military-specific training program. I ended up going to a place in Kansas though, so can't speak to the quality of training at AZFTC. I'd imagine if you know anyone at Luke they can get you first-hand gouge. Where did you go in Kansas? I'm near ICT and looking to get it done sooner rather than later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HercDude Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Where did you go in Kansas? I'm near ICT and looking to get it done sooner rather than later. I went to Prairie Air Service in Benton, about 20 min outside Wichita I think. It's a one-man show run out of the guy's house on Stearman Field (which is an awesome place to go anyway - there's about a dozen Stearmans based there along with an assortment of old warbirds). PAS ran me more than Accessible Aviation or some of the other names you'll find on this thread. I personally had a problem with giving Nuzzo any of my money, so I looked around elsewhere for a reputable place. Herb Pello is the owner and has been instructing since the 70's. Unlike All ATPs, Accessible, etc. he let me learn at a pace I was comfortable with, so I had over 15 hours in his PA-23 before my check. Some guys may be comfortable jumping into a light twin - I definitely wasn't (IFT was my only experience with piston & civilian flying) and was very thankful for the training I got there. Maybe I'm not as good a pilot as I think I am, but I don't see how on earth I could have flown a single-engine ILS with less than 1/4 scale deflection after only 3 hours in that thing. Still knocked it all out in 5 days though, and the DPE he used was very fair. Here is his website: http://www.prairieairservice.com/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbigred300 Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 Alright my main question is if you guys recommend going to a course that is only a couple of days and only provides one flight and a checkride? Or is that a risky move considering you barely know how to fly the plane at that point? I am trying to decide which ATP practical program is right for me and I have read through the entire threat here and on Airline Pilot Forums and talked to several of the companies as well. It seems that the amount of money and flying training you get varies widely between these companies. Also, this is obviously a check the box type of activity, so I really want the cheapest and fastest way to get it done without failing my checkride (which I imagine is exactly what most people want). I am not using the GI Bill because I want to save it and it doesn't seem like a good use of a bunch of months of benefits. These are the companies I have compared which would be close to where I live in the Northeast: All ATPs: (nearest location for me is Trenton, NJ) - they do roughly 10 hours of flight training and it costs about $5000. No thank you. Higher Power Aviation (HPA Training - Dallas - get a 737 type rating (personally I am not interested in spending that much money or spending that much time). Accessible Aviation - Columbus AFB - not interested in dealing with "crazy carl" judging from the feedback on the forums. Sanders Aviation - Alabama - approximately $3500. Good reviews but far from where I live and about the same amount of money as places closer in the northeast. Downtown Aviation - Memphis - quoted 1600-1800 and you get it done in two flights and two days. Seems like the best deal for time and money. Hortman Aviation - Philadelphia - Typically 6-12 hours of flying time - they said to expect $3500ish and about a week of training. Middle River Aviation - Baltimore - I am told they are about $3500 as well, and I have heard a lot of guys going there recently - also something about them basically guaranteeing you will get it? Not sure if that is true. Boston guy - the mythical guy that no one can get in touch with. Seems to be a great deal if you can. I don't have his price details or contact information though...Please PM me if you do!! So my question to you all is this: Why would anyone spend $3500 and more time to do any of these programs other than one like Downtown Aviation? For those of yu who have done Downtown or any other really abbreviated course, should I be concerned about failing my checkride due to lack of preparation? I am a C-17 IP with pretty much no civilian flying experience. The courses that cost $3500 provide hours more in flight instruction....is this recommended or not necessary? Bottom line....I want an ATP and don't want to fail my first attempt. If that costs $3500 than so be it, but I don't want to waste my time or money. Thanks for the help! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dupe Posted January 15, 2015 Share Posted January 15, 2015 These are the companies I have compared which would be close to where I live in the Northeast: If you're in the upper right-hand quadrant of our country, you may also want to look at Acton Multi in Groton, CT and Dash Aviation in Sanford, ME. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BUSTED Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) For anyone in the North Texas/Oklahoma region... Five stars for Cobra Kai Flight Academy in Wichita Falls. They may have a stupid name, but they're a great program. Just finished up my ATP with them. All of their instructors are retired AF pilots who used to teach at ENJJPT (the two guys who own it are German AF, and there are several USAF guys that work there). $3150 total ($2650 to Cobra Kai, $500 to the DPE). Money gets you: -Academics -6 hours of flight (2x 2-hour practice flights with an instructor, and 2 hrs for the checkride) -A very helpful practice ground-eval prior to sending you across the ramp to the DPE They train in a Baron, it's exactly what you'd expect out of a GA airplane (READ: old, far from ergonomic). It broke while I was there, which added an extra day to my training, but they've got their own mechanic who had it fixed by the next day. They also let you sandbag on other training flights if there's someone else going through at the same time (I didn't have anyone else to sandbag with, but a new guy showed up and was able to sandbag on my second training flight... I'm pretty sure it was for free, but didn't ask). DPE was very friendly. Ground eval was more relaxed than I expected. Overall, great experience. EDIT: Not getting to sandbag didn't hurt me any, their training is great at preparing you for the checkride. Also, you can only sandbag on a training flight, not a checkride. Edited January 16, 2015 by BUSTED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O Face Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 (edited) BigRed300, Go to Downtown in Memphis, they are going to prepare you for your checkride, don't worry about failing. You fly the exact checkride profile the day prior and they supply you with all the study materials you need to pass the oral eval. The IP is a Guard C-17 pilot and the DPE is a great old dude who even took my buddy up in his T-6 following their checkride. The price is unbeatable, and you can stay at billeting on the Navy base in Millington which provides a good free breakfast and has a decent beer garden right in lodging. Don't waste your money going to all ATP's or something, you have enough C-17 time, I'm pretty sure the airline doesn't care about the extra 10hrs of time you log in some shitty Piper Seminole at All ATP's or whatever. I cannot say enough positive thing about my experience here. Edited January 16, 2015 by O Face 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Can you do an ATP practical with the Class III you get just by keeping your 1042 current or do you have to have a Class I at the time? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Champ Kind Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Can you do an ATP practical with the Class III you get just by keeping your 1042 current or do you have to have a Class I at the time? I'm scheduled with Skywarrior in Pensacola. They said I just needed to bring my 1042. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HossHarris Posted January 16, 2015 Share Posted January 16, 2015 Crazy Carl is disorganized, frustrating, and even insulting at times. But the results are worth putting up with his shenanigans. I'd look elsewhere if he has raised his prices, but for the 3-3.5k I felt I got adequate flight time to crush the check ride. And the dpe was a touchdown to boot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HercDude Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Alright my main question is if you guys recommend going to a course that is only a couple of days and only provides one flight and a checkride? Or is that a risky move considering you barely know how to fly the plane at that point? This right here is why I chose the path I did. Flying a light twin is weird. The PA-23 I flew was crazy sensitive compared to anything I could remember flying, and it seemed as if I moved my head 3" to the right, the plane would instantaneously put it's self in a 5° bank. The trim was on the ceiling, it had a vaccum powered ADI, and seemed to get tossed like a rag doll by 15 knot winds. I had also never flown under foggles or in the local area where I took my check. If you think you can overcome these challenges - and I have no doubt many people can - in just 4-5 hrs of flight time, then I'd go with any of those courses you see with high marks. Failing this check would be a huge black mark that will follow you around for a long time. Do your research, make a lot of phone calls, don't be afraid to spend money, and don't go with a course you aren't comfortable with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HossHarris Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Light twins are certainly different...but it's not rocket surgery. You won't be completely comfortable after 1-2 flights nor will you feel like you have mastered the airframe, but that is NOT required for the check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerkStud Posted January 18, 2015 Share Posted January 18, 2015 Has anyone tried out or know of someone who did their ATP with action multi ratings in Groton, CT? Thinking about trying to get it done there and hope to get some feedback on them. PM me if you'd like. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 I just got my ATP/737 Type from Higher Power and can't begin to say enough good things about them. The course for the 737 NG cost $11,100, which was conveniently just under the annual cap for the GI Bill (though it looks like the price may be going up since their acquistion by All ATPs). You do need to pay upfront, and they estimate reimbursement from the VA will take about 3 months. The first week is ground school and you should expect to be very busy; my typical day consisted of eight hours in the classroom, 2-3 studying with my classmates, and another 2-3 on my own. That said, they do an excellent job preparing you for the oral exam. For the sims, I was fortunate enough to be paired with another student, meaning I got the benefit of seeing everything twice (if you don't have a partner, they pair you with an instructor and I believe you only get to do one sim from the right seat). You get a total of 5 sorties in the left seat, followed by the checkride. By the second day of sims, we were practicing the entire checkride profile, plus some additional V1 cuts. As with the oral, they do a great job prepping you for the checkride, and it should be a breeze for any military pilot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hueypilot Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 Light twins are certainly different...but it's not rocket surgery. You won't be completely comfortable after 1-2 flights nor will you feel like you have mastered the airframe, but that is NOT required for the check. It's like flying a Cessna Skyhawk...except with two engines, folding gear and controllable pitch prop. No big deal at all. SE stuff is pretty benign if you get on the rudder right away and have your feathering procedure down pat. But flying characteristics...just like any other light GA airplane. I got 6 hours in a Beech Duchess before my ATP check...I was pretty comfortable with it by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HossHarris Posted January 25, 2015 Share Posted January 25, 2015 No radar, no pod, no hts, no datalink, no wingmen, no enemies, no threats. Moves in slow motion. Not cosmic. You can handle an extra lever for the prop and mixture. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robo Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Who was the check with Hoss? I've heard there are two DPEs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 In the last year there have been two, recently only one has been giving checkrides there. From guys I've talked to, the other examiner is similar. Also, don't take all the positive endorsements of Downtown Aviation to mean that they simply trade your cash for an ATP cert. You still do a legit checkride; it is just a program that is better tailored for experienced dudes who don't need extensive lessons in airmanship. The examiners grade to the FAA ATP requirements and not random additional approaches/maneuvers they simply think would be nice to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
disgruntledemployee Posted February 26, 2015 Share Posted February 26, 2015 Downtown...It's a course for grown ups and you have to come well prepared like a grown up. It's not the first day of elementary school, it more like the final exam review and prep ride for that Sr year college class that you've been studying for. Like the other say, you're hours and experience have prepared you to fly. They spend their time (and your money) making sure you know what you need to know and that you can safely fly a twin. The last thing they want is to get a rep as rubber stampers (butters) as the FAA will clamp that down. So "Mil Friendly" to me means they understand our background, understand how we log hours, and understand our level of experience. Hoss is right. Smokin is right. Robo, give them a call. They're likely booked out to the summer. Out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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