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Promotion and PRF Information

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1 hour ago, Recut said:

Yup.  my push mentions nothing of commanding.  Wonder why we play these games though when there's the "command track" and other BS nonsense and operators on the other hand.   Why wait until now when I was never on the command track to tell me I'm not on the command track? 

Again, I am good and not bitter at all.  Dent to the ego but I knew where I stood as a captain, let alone at this board.  I've always been an operator and have never played "the game" so this is no surprise for me. 

an "operator".

lulz. love it.

you got your subdued c-17 SOL2 patches on or wat? get at me son

#C-17_Delta_Force

#Bitch_I_Operate

don't take it personally bro i'm a few whiskey's deep at 2 am....its all good

but for the record youre a pilot. Not. An. Operator. 

Nothing wrong with that. I’m a pilot too. Shots x69

Edited by BashiChuni
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Ok douchebag, I’m not trying to be cool. I entered this AF in the late 90s and by “operator” I meant pilot or operations vice pencil pusher. Punch yourself. 

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4 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

an "operator".

lulz. love it.

you got your subdued c-17 SOL2 patches on or wat? get at me son

#C-17_Delta_Force

#Bitch_I_Operate

don't take it personally bro i'm a few whiskey's deep at 2 am....its all good

but for the record youre a pilot. Not. An. Operator. 

Nothing wrong with that. I’m a pilot too. Shots x69

How's life over there in the pilot group?  Because at my wing, we have an Operations Group.

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Bashi, what’s going on in your life man? You’ve been a negative Nancy for a while man.

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Bashi, what’s going on in your life man? You’ve been a negative Nancy for a while man.

I’m guessing it’s the pre-op hormones they have him taking.
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When talking about command pushes, is there a massive difference between saying “ready for command now” in the first half of the push, versus “Sq/CC next” in the second half?

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2 hours ago, ihtfp06 said:


I’m guessing it’s the pre-op hormones they have him taking.

I thought TriCare stopped paying for those? 

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8 hours ago, Duck said:

Bashi, what’s going on in your life man? You’ve been a negative Nancy for a while man.

Stressed out about making major I guess

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I think it’s funny Bashi talks like a 12 year old playing Call is Duty whilst drunk.

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1 hour ago, matmacwc said:

I think it’s funny Bashi talks like a 12 year old playing Call is Duty fortnite whilst drunk.

fify

its the rage among all millennials.

 

 

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Stressed out about making major I guess

You’re gonna be okay man. I mean by the time you hit your Majors board, it will be back to 85%.

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1 hour ago, Lord Ratner said:
15 hours ago, Duck said:
Bashi, what’s going on in your life man? You’ve been a negative Nancy for a while man.

But in an awkward, PYB way...

don't put that evil on me...

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But uh, back to the lecture at hand...

 

13 hours ago, olevelo said:

When talking about command pushes, is there a massive difference between saying “ready for command now” in the first half of the push, versus “Sq/CC next” in the second half?

At face value, no.  In reality, it depends...

It depends on your WG/CC and how he racks and stacks you.  If you get a DP from the boss, you're golden, regardless what the push is.  If you get a solid strat coupled to that push, you should be ok.  If there's no strat, no DP, no "super P" a la "if I had one more DP to give", and the push is "Sq/CC next"...it's up to the board to decide where they want you.

As I said before, a 10/20 strat sometimes isn't enough when it's balanced against a weak command push, or visa versa.  Take 5 DPs out of the that pool of 20 and the 10/20 is really 5/15, which is a clean kill, right?  But a weak command push can sink that ship.  Likewise, a dude that's a functional alcoholic or has multiple Q-3s and gets no strat, but gets a strong "command now" push because he's personally liked for what he's done recently for leadership, and gets promoted.

Unfortunately, it all depends on what the current flavor of the week.  It could be that all the WG/CC's decided to go with "Ready for command now!" and one outlier went with "Sq/CC next" and the board decides to weigh at it different.  It's opaque and impossible to read the middle of the pack unless you actually sit in the board.  That's why they never tell anyone who was on the board or why the decided the way they did.  (instead, a poor civilian gets to apologize to the runners up and take an educated stab at why they didn't make it)  

Perhaps that's just what integrity first looks like in an "I'm as good as you" society.

 

...Perfection is perfected, so I'ma let 'em understand...

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17 hours ago, Duck said:

Bashi, what’s going on in your life man? You’ve been a negative Nancy for a while man.

Duck, you clearly took that Green Dot training to heart. 

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18 hours ago, FourFans130 said:

 

Unfortunately, it all depends on what the current flavor of the week.  It could be that all the WG/CC's decided to go with "Ready for command now!" and one outlier went with "Sq/CC next" and the board decides to weigh at it different.  It's opaque and impossible to read the middle of the pack unless you actually sit in the board.  

So, this makes me wonder.  Does everyone that gets promoted to LtCol get a command push (whatever the flavor)?  Future commanders are the exception to the pack (at least in reality) so not everyone should get a command push.  Yes, party line says the AF promotes based on potential but few will actually command.  Any old heads that can weigh on this?  

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Yes. The previously required items for promotion (from several former board members I personally know):

For a P: “definitely promote”, or even better “if I had one more DP” or the like; “ready for Sq/CC now” or very similar; HAF or higher staff; and SDE all in the push. A strat added to the push is also good. See Skitzo’s post for a good example.

Anything that deviates is negative.

For a DP: according to the CSAF/SECAF, only the SR’s choice of DP should matter; however, I know two people who were passed over with a DP because board members felt their record didn’t warrant a DP and the SR was trying to get someone promoted.

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6 minutes ago, ThreeHoler said:

Yes. The previously required items for promotion (from several former board members I personally know):

For a P: “definitely promote”, or even better “if I had one more DP” or the like; “ready for Sq/CC now” or very similar; HAF or higher staff; and SDE all in the push. A strat added to the push is also good. See Skitzo’s post for a good example.

Anything that deviates is negative.

For a DP: according to the CSAF/SECAF, only the SR’s choice of DP should matter; however, I know two people who were passed over with a DP because board members felt their record didn’t warrant a DP and the SR was trying to get someone promoted.

Nice explanation - appreciate it!

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3 hours ago, ThreeHoler said:

...and the SR was trying to get someone promoted.

Heaven help the commander who tries to promote someone on subjective "good leadership" qualities that might not translate well onto a PRF.

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9 hours ago, ThreeHoler said:

Yes. The previously required items for promotion (from several former board members I personally know):

For a P: “definitely promote”, or even better “if I had one more DP” or the like; “ready for Sq/CC now” or very similar; HAF or higher staff; and SDE all in the push. A strat added to the push is also good. See Skitzo’s post for a good example.

Anything that deviates is negative.

For a DP: according to the CSAF/SECAF, only the SR’s choice of DP should matter; however, I know two people who were passed over with a DP because board members felt their record didn’t warrant a DP and the SR was trying to get someone promoted.

So, why even allow the Senior Rater to allocate DPs and Ps?  If the board is just going to override the decision, why even give the WG/CCs the decision at all?  Just remove the check box and let the board decided if that person is a DP or P.

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So, why even allow the Senior Rater to allocate DPs and Ps?  If the board is just going to override the decision, why even give the WG/CCs the decision at all?  Just remove the check box and let the board decided if that person is a DP or P.

Great idea. Currently being ops tested on the O-4 board.

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1 hour ago, pawnman said:

So, why even allow the Senior Rater to allocate DPs and Ps?  If the board is just going to override the decision, why even give the WG/CCs the decision at all?  Just remove the check box and let the board decided if that person is a DP or P.

I guess it has something to do with it being a Promotion 'Recommendation' Form.  

I hear your frustration but when you look at the recent years and how many guys have been given an IPZ DP and passed over it comes out to something like 0.01% chance (however the math works out).  Don't get me wrong, it definitely sucks for those individuals.  Also, don't forget that a SR's DP allocation has nothing to do with the quality of officers he is rating.  So if a Wing CC has 9 IPZ O-4s for the O-5 board and gets 4(?) DPs, it doesn't mean that #4/9 is automatically better than what would be the first non-selected for promotion guy without a DP.  

I agree with you that it appears messed up (and probably most times is), but it actually goes to show that board is looking at the entire record and not just automatically promoting DPs.  I have personally heard a Wing CC say how he will get grilled by his fellow Wing CCs if it looks like they're speeding/just trying to get a guy promoted without the record showing continued performance.

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