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Promotion and PRF Information

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Homestar    360
6 hours ago, Duck said:

The only people I see this really screws are guys who are on their second look for this board. If they promote all the APZers it really fvcks them when they were making plans to separate/go to the Guard/provide for their family, etc. Hopefully they still take letters to the board in consideration.

There's no ADSC for promotion. All it does is make a guy serve his 10 year ADSC for UPT. Something 99.9% of all pilots intend to do anyway. 

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olevelo    4
I think it should be easier than that. No fluff in OPRs. Just strats. Give all of your people a positional strat, rank strat, and CGO/FGO strat.  Do it annually to replace OPRs. I have never understood why only the top 15-20 percent get strats when we promote 90-95 percent to Major and 60ish percent to Lt Col.  
#80/100 Captains should be good enough for Maj. And it lets that individual know that while he/she will make Major, he/she has to make improvements to make Lt Col.  This is a much better thing that to lump together the bottom 80-85 percent who don't get strats.
And then no time-wasting bullets.

While on the surface that seems like a good idea, the problem is that not all units are created equal. Nor do they have similar sizes. #9/10 in small elite pool might be equivalent to #3/100 in another, but there's no way to quantify that.

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olevelo    4
The only people I see this really screws are guys who are on their second look for this board. If they promote all the APZers it really fvcks them when they were making plans to separate/go to the Guard/provide for their family, etc. Hopefully they still take letters to the board in consideration.

My guess is that the 100% opportunity is for IPZ only. APZ folks are screwed. Or blessed, depending on your perspective.

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HU&W    603
9 minutes ago, olevelo said:


My guess is that the 100% opportunity is for IPZ only. APZ folks are screwed. Or blessed, depending on your perspective.

My guess is that they promote every single APZ and continued Captain that doesn't have derogatory information.  Just as valid.

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Duck    852
3 hours ago, Homestar said:

There's no ADSC for promotion. All it does is make a guy serve his 10 year ADSC for UPT. Something 99.9% of all pilots intend to do anyway. 

Have ya checked the Palace Chase webpage on mypers lately? I think most pilots are looking for an early out from the 10 year sentence. 

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Duck    852
21 minutes ago, olevelo said:


My guess is that the 100% opportunity is for IPZ only. APZ folks are screwed. Or blessed, depending on your perspective.

I hope you're right.

11 minutes ago, HU&W said:

My guess is that they promote every single APZ and continued Captain that doesn't have derogatory information.  Just as valid.

I seriously hate you right now. Lol

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panchbarnes    164
20 hours ago, drewpey said:

Is this something to be angry about?  It was already a 90% promote rate, and if you are looking to get a strat you aren't concerned about pinning on, but rather getting a school slot.  This doesn't change that.

Higher promotion rates are better for everyone.  It gives people more flexibility in their careers without getting completely hosed because they didn't follow the expected career path.  Sure old crusties get their panties in a wad because "major used to mean something"...but the more off-ramps the USAF removes on the highway to LtCol the more likely the "flying-only" career path is for guys who just want to fly.  The checking of boxes for career progression (SOS, Masters, Flt/CC, ADO) is the epitome of kabuki theater, and the easier they make it to get promoted the less box-checking we have to deal with.

I for one welcome more FGOs into the court martial duty pool.

Just a bit angry because of the people I know that were affected by the 2014 force shaping fiasco.  Good dudes getting passed over, RIFed, told to volunteer outside of duty hours in order to be on the RIF protected list.  It all could have been avoided.  Debbie James came from SAIC and was known as a downsizing specialist, so to prove her worth she decided to make the cut in one year, instead of doing it incrementally, because what worked in the private sector must work for the government right?  Sure there are political pressures from the top to make the downsizing happen, but she could have stalled or at least make an appearance of trying to fend off the wolves.  She was more than happy to "swing the axe" (borrowing Gen Goldfein's term).  I say fire the people involved with the the downsizing because they didn't talk sense into the SECAF and they did a horrible job of planning and executing the downsizing.

On a related note, I understand many flyers on here just want to fly and not do staff time because it's a shitty job.  However, the "Staff" can use more the "Been There Done That" flyers to lead or guide the planning and execution of plans and strategies.  You don't want to only push HPOs or unqualified folks into certain critical staff jobs for a year and move on.  We would have no credibility in the Joint world and it would be detrimental to the fighting force.

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flyusaf83    98
1 hour ago, olevelo said:


While on the surface that seems like a good idea, the problem is that not all units are created equal. Nor do they have similar sizes. #9/10 in small elite pool might be equivalent to #3/100 in another, but there's no way to quantify that.

How is that any different then the situation now? Strats and awards (to a lesser degree) are the only things that the board cares about, anyway.  The rest is fluff.

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BashiChuni    252
5 hours ago, Duck said:

Have ya checked the Palace Chase webpage on mypers lately? I think most pilots are looking for an early out from the 10 year sentence. 

Lol ok drama queen

its not a "10 year sentence"

yes im getting out as many others but I've had a great time. Maybe you can keep your overly cynical dramatic opinions to yourself a little more around here. 

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DUNBAR    30

I think we're really missing the most noteworthy part of that AFPC news release.  Specifically, there is actually a duty title called "Chief of Workforce Development for the Air Force Talent Management Innovation Cell." 

I wonder if there's a Deputy Chief as well.

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drewpey    101
8 hours ago, panchbarnes said:

 On a related note, I understand many flyers on here just want to fly and not do staff time because it's a shitty job.  However, the "Staff" can use more the "Been There Done That" flyers to lead or guide the planning and execution of plans and strategies.  You don't want to only push HPOs or unqualified folks into certain critical staff jobs for a year and move on.  We would have no credibility in the Joint world and it would be detrimental to the fighting force.

I completely agree. There are plenty of guys burned out from flying unit ops and are looking for predictability and to reconnect with family. Every time I had to interact with a TSOC staff there were HPO fliers without any relevant experience to help, and they were making poor decisions on our behalf out of ignorance. It would be nice to see these jobs open up for folks who haven't been designated HPO but would be solid workers for 3-4 years. Again the USAF puts too much emphasis on the job and not performance. From what I've seen in the USMC rating system it looks like they have it figured out. Weighted to prevent overrating everyone, and more emphasis on how well you did the job you were assigned. Then hopefully your have folks gravitate to the jobs they wanted to do without detriment to their career. Then after a few years remove the empty jobs no one wants to do! 

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Duck    852
4 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

Lol ok drama queen

its not a "10 year sentence"

yes im getting out as many others but I've had a great time. Maybe you can keep your overly cynical dramatic opinions to yourself a little more around here. 

Lol no. I'll drop the cynicism as soon as the AF starts living up to their end of the bargain. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

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Homestar    360
11 hours ago, Duck said:

Have ya checked the Palace Chase webpage on mypers lately? I think most pilots are looking for an early out from the 10 year sentence. 

You're right. But most won't be approved or will only be approved for a 6 month curtailment. 

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Swizzle    30

It's projected to be APZers and IPZers. I don't know if and where the APZ cutoff is...perhaps none as there is only 'IPZ' now by the new definition, or maybe they stop at 5 years APZ...who knows. I doubt they've thought of advertising this critical info.

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Duck    852
3 minutes ago, Swizzle said:

It's projected to be APZers and IPZers. I don't know if and where the APZ cutoff is...perhaps none as there is only 'IPZ' now by the new definition, or maybe they stop at 5 years APZ...who knows. I doubt they've thought of advertising this critical info.

Standard AF. Fire, Aim, Ready.

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matmacwc    1,093

Somebody is going to sneak one by the goalie and make O-4 when nobody saw it coming.  It should be entertaining.  

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olevelo    4
How is that any different then the situation now? Strats and awards (to a lesser degree) are the only things that the board cares about, anyway.  The rest is fluff.

It's not any different, and the strat system sucks now too.

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BashiChuni    252
3 hours ago, Duck said:

Lol no. I'll drop the cynicism as soon as the AF starts living up to their end of the bargain. Don't hate the player, hate the game.

bro I get it trust me. but good lord every post is doom and gloom. enjoy life a little baaaaBEEEEEEEEE!

its fine to be cynical, but when every post is dripping w/ negativity ...

anyways see you in the airlines.

 

ps the AF will never live up to their end of the bargin. #ProTip

Edited by BashiChuni
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Duck    852
56 minutes ago, BashiChuni said:

bro I get it trust me. but good lord every post is doom and gloom. enjoy life a little baaaaBEEEEEEEEE!

its fine to be cynical, but when every post is dripping w/ negativity ...

anyways see you in the airlines.

 

ps the AF will never live up to their end of the bargin. #ProTip

Valid criticism. I am just tired of getting the rug pulled out from under me and my family, one failed AF personnel policy at a time. I have not had it the worst at all by a long shot, but enough that me and my family went to lengths to get passed over on the very first O-4 board I had. Once I get out, I can promise to never post on here again.

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BashiChuni    252

i enjoy duck posts that are insightful, thoughtful, and smart. keep posting.

if being forced to make O-4 is the worst that happens to you then you're a very blessed man.

perspective i guess.

anyways cheers to you bro i wish you nothing but the best.

 

break break back on topic...will this 100% to major policy start to chip away at the mindless number of award packages the collective "we" has to accomplish? 15 line, 30 line, etc etc etc...so and so of the qtr/year blah blah blah?

Edited by BashiChuni
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MooseAg03    127

 
break break back on topic...will this 100% to major policy start to chip away at the mindless number of award packages the collective "we" has to accomplish? 15 line, 30 line, etc etc etc...so and so of the qtr/year blah blah blah?


I doubt it, how else will the chosen 3-4 guys in each wing be identified for school? It may eliminate excess work for those who were submitting an award or 2 to make sure they didn't wind up in the bottom 5% at their Major's board. I can say there's a few things I wouldn't have bothered with if O-4 had been 100%.

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17D_guy    307
2 hours ago, BashiChuni said:

break break back on topic...will this 100% to major policy start to chip away at the mindless number of award packages the collective "we" has to accomplish? 15 line, 30 line, etc etc etc...so and so of the qtr/year blah blah blah?

Negative.  This is pushed from higher, with bad word-of-mouth if a unit/wing isn't putting in for these BS awards.  I can say when I've been in positions to deal with these, everything we can "neg respond" on, we did.  That was a pitiful number though.

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Duck    852

I actually think this is a great idea for pilots. In fact I would argue for it to be 100% to Lt Col and even promote separately and at a faster rate than the rest of the AF. The rollout was completely botched, yet again by Big Blue.

The problem that I see is two fold. First, this is being portrayed as a knee jerk reaction with very little planning for thought behind it. No where do I see this is going to be permanent, which means it will be business as usual for all the queep that goes into normal promotions. This is simply a backdoor stoploss for O-3s. I am wondering if a lot of guys wrote the board last time requesting to be passed over  hence the surprisingly low O-3 pilots selected for O-4.

 

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HU&W    603
9 hours ago, DUNBAR said:

I think we're really missing the most noteworthy part of that AFPC news release.  Specifically, there is actually a duty title called "Chief of Workforce Development for the Air Force Talent Management Innovation Cell." 

I wonder if there's a Deputy Chief as well.

I wonder if their office symbol is AFPC/COWDFTAFTMIC

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