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Promotion and PRF Information


Guest e3racing

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3 hours ago, Weezer said:

Agreed that your leadership should be providing you feedback (mine did not when I got passed over).  I think it's helpful to have feedback outside your chain as well.  Even if your SR was on the board, they are sworn to secrecy, and may not have had records on their docket that would be right to compare yours to.  Sometimes your leadership could be actively trying to screw you over, too...

The AFPC phone call is a post mortem on your specific record compared to low selects/high non-selects from your specific board.  Your leadership is not likely to have anything that specific.

 

 

Aren't SRs by reg supposed to sit down with you and give you feedback, or maybe I'm thinking of the actual PRF itself? 

As for actively screwing, a former commander I had the privilege to exec for would brag about how he will screw over people's careers if they don't fit his mold of leadership.  If there is karma he will be a known entity to said folks at Delta/United/AA when he goes in for his interview, if he makes it that far.  

Conversely, another former commander would sit every officer down after every OPR, PRF and wouldn't hesitate to tell a guy he was #5/10/20 out of 20 and what they can do to fix it in the next year.  

 

 

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7 hours ago, dream big said:

Aren't SRs by reg supposed to sit down with you and give you feedback, or maybe I'm thinking of the actual PRF itself?  

 

 

I think in both cases they can delegate to a lower commander (group CC) in my case.  That feedback was more of making sure I wasn't going to hurt myself or others and letting me know it was all over and thanks for playing than what might have happened at the board.

I got my PRF in a sealed envelope.  I showed to my Sq/CC (who had forwarded the initial draft).  He looked at it and kind of furrowed his brow and said "Hmm...not how I would've done it but I guess different Senior Raters have their own way of doing it...you're probably fine."  Kind of knew I was screwed there.

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The best advice I've received since getting passed over came from another man who had a similar experience (checked the right boxes, nothing negative, excellent line operator, surprise non-promote):

"Your life just got a lot easier, you just don't know it yet."

He pointed out the importance of people (for however long they might stay in the AF) that can call a spade a spade without worrying if it will hurt their promotion chances.  He also pointed out that once you're done in the USAF, no one gives a second thought to if you're a retired major, colonel, or general...it simply doesn't matter.  If you're a pilot, a dispatcher, driver, or someone else, that's your job, end of story.

He flies big civil planes now where his work day is done and he's headed home before the engines stop spinning, and a driver is waiting on him to take him to the hotel which is already paid for.  (strange how you never hear about dispatchers, drivers, and baggage handlers in private aviation demanding the same treatment as pilots at those companies in name of "fairness")

That perspective made me realize it doesn't matter who gave the "you're not promoted" news nor how.  No changing it, and it's the AF's loss.  No matter how important they might be saying pilot retention is, they've made it clear again that line performance will not get you promoted nor continued.

To the AF, it all boils down to lines of text on a piece of paper, regardless of how excellent your aviation record, how many lives you've saved, or how many combat sorties you've flown.

To me, none of that defines my value as a pilot or a person.  If the AF doesn't want talent, that's their problem, not mine.

How much more do I need to know?

FF

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9 hours ago, dream big said:

Aren't SRs by reg supposed to sit down with you and give you feedback, or maybe I'm thinking of the actual PRF itself? 

 

You should get feedback from your immediate supervisor and/or rater, or Sq/CC if you're at the squadron.  If he/she doesn't schedule you, schedule yourself.

You should get PRF feedback from your SR.  If you're meeting an IPZ board your should schedule yourself when PRFs are done.  You should have probably seen a draft of the PRF before it was sent up.  The only thing new to you should be the push line on the bottom.

Like others have said, even if the DP box isn't checked, if you don't see the words "definitely promote" in the push line you have a big question to ask.

 

Edited by Homestar
grammar
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4 hours ago, FourFans130 said:

The best advice I've received since getting passed over came from another man who had a similar experience (checked the right boxes, nothing negative, excellent line operator, surprise non-promote):

"Your life just got a lot easier, you just don't know it yet."

He pointed out the importance of people (for however long they might stay in the AF) that can call a spade a spade without worrying if it will hurt their promotion chances.  He also pointed out that once you're done in the USAF, no one gives a second thought to if you're a retired major, colonel, or general...it simply doesn't matter.  If you're a pilot, a dispatcher, driver, or someone else, that's your job, end of story.

He flies big civil planes now where his work day is done and he's headed home before the engines stop spinning, and a driver is waiting on him to take him to the hotel which is already paid for.  (strange how you never hear about dispatchers, drivers, and baggage handlers in private aviation demanding the same treatment as pilots at those companies in name of "fairness")

That perspective made me realize it doesn't matter who gave the "you're not promoted" news nor how.  No changing it, and it's the AF's loss.  No matter how important they might be saying pilot retention is, they've made it clear again that line performance will not get you promoted nor continued.

To the AF, it all boils down to lines of text on a piece of paper, regardless of how excellent your aviation record, how many lives you've saved, or how many combat sorties you've flown.

To me, none of that defines my value as a pilot or a person.  If the AF doesn't want talent, that's their problem, not mine.

How much more do I need to know?

FF

Being the grumpy old guy can be a hell of a lot of fun, too!

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4 hours ago, FourFans130 said:

To me, none of that defines my value as a pilot or a person.  If the AF doesn't want talent, that's their problem, not mine.

 

This.

A strange game.  The only winning move is not to play.

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Getting passed over and getting to focus on flying/instructing/developing wingmen (not the catch all Air Force term) & copilots is a silver lining....IF you actually get to do that.  I've seen so many passed over guys shoved into a cubicle on wing staff flying once a month (instructors).  Their next door neighbors, the wing execs, are weapons officers.  Wtf are we doing..

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2 hours ago, dream big said:

Getting passed over and getting to focus on flying/instructing/developing wingmen (not the catch all Air Force term) & copilots is a silver lining....IF you actually get to do that.  I've seen so many passed over guys shoved into a cubicle on wing staff flying once a month (instructors).  Their next door neighbors, the wing execs, are weapons officers.  Wtf are we doing..

The other phenomenon I've observed are passed-over guys being used as 179/365 cannon fodder precisely because they can never achieve bright/shiny status. Sad as hell when that soul was sold to any permutation of the multi-year bonus.

No other reason to stay at a company that has effectively gotten slave labor on the cheap with passed-over guys 'filling every undesirable hole' if you will.

<screaming GO TO THE AIRLINES! whiles typing>

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Just a thought... wouldn't the shift to a summer board for O-5 cut down on Narrative Only PRFs for people going to school?

Typically folks PCS and get a NO, now SRs can actually divvy out DPs to shiny pennies instead of taking their chances with the school MLR or whatever that process is.


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2 minutes ago, Skitzo said:

Just a thought... wouldn't the shift to a summer board for O-5 cut down on Narrative Only PRFs for people going to school?

Typically folks PCS and get a NO, now SRs can actually divvy out DPs to shiny pennies instead of taking their chances with the school MLR or whatever that process is.


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Possibly, but wouldn't it also increase the rush to get a PRF written on a brand new dude fresh from school?  The school MLR is pretty successful.  DPs are still given (to some, same allocation % as big AF) with great success to P's.  100% IPZ promotion this year at ACSC anyway. 

 

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MyPers O-4 release status board updated, pushed back to Late June - Mid July

Muthafvckers!!!! It freaking sat doing nothing at SAF for over 1 month and they wonder why we are so pissed off. B!tches can't even meet their own suspenses that they set for themselves. Getting a promotion select list to the under SECDEF to approve isn't freaking surgery people. What would you say you do here?


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Muthafvckers!!!! It freaking sat doing nothing at SAF for over 1 month and they wonder why we are so pissed off. B!tches can't even meet their own suspenses that they set for themselves. Getting a promotion select list to the under SECDEF to approve isn't freaking surgery people. What would you say you do here?


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And they can't seem to figure out how to get people to stay in such a dysfunctional organization.


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1 hour ago, Duck said:


Muthafvckers!!!! It freaking sat doing nothing at SAF for over 1 month and they wonder why we are so pissed off. B!tches can't even meet their own suspenses that they set for themselves. Getting a promotion select list to the under SECDEF to approve isn't freaking surgery people. What would you say you do here?


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Woooo Duck. Lets all just relax. Do you need a beer light timeout to gather your thoughts and emotions? Or should I go to my "safe space?"

Edited by hatedont
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11 minutes ago, hatedont said:

Woooo Duck. Lets all just relax. Do you need a beer light timeout to gather your thoughts and emotions?

No.  No he does not. No time out necessary. This is a fucking ridiculous state of affairs when the service can't seem to figure out why everyone is bailing. 

I'll add I have no dog in this fight, but I was an '05 guy who had his board delayed an entire year.  Made the VSP application that much easier. 

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Woooo Duck. Lets all just relax. Do you need a beer light timeout to gather your thoughts and emotions? Or should I go to my "safe space?"

I put up with your incoherent posts and even partially agreed with one or two. In all sincerity, it truly frightens me that there are officers in the Air Force as dumb as you project yourself to be on this forum.

I mean that with all due respect.


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I was joking with you. I'm not the one cursing and screaming like a 5 year old in timeout. *Your constant bitching serves no purpose here. 

If you saw me in person Duck, I would slap the taste out of your mouth little man. I would have no problem telling my CC why I did it either.* If you are going to be a little bitch, then don't post. Take your bottle of breast milk to your room. 

 

God ing dammit I'm getting sick of these douchey Chang-like trolls on this forum!

 

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14 minutes ago, hatedont said:

If you saw me in person Duck, I would slap the taste out of your mouth little man. I would have no problem telling my CC why I did it either.

And here we go again. Mods... please? What has this guy added in the last few weeks?  Even Butters took a clue and trolled elsewhere. 

Edited by FUSEPLUG
Sucks when you're quoted before you edit out your stupid.
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I was joking with you. I'm not the one cursing, screaming, and throwing a tantrum like a 5 year old in timeout. If you are going to be a little bitch, then don't post. Take your bottle of breast milk to your room. 
For a guy who doesn't care about promotion, you seem to care a lot about the release of the results. 

Wow. You really are an idiot aren't you? You aren't putting on a show. This isn't you trying to be a troll. This is really you. You really have no clue. In that case, please accept my apology. I genuinely feel bad for going fangs out at you. That wasn't a fair fight. My bad.


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