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I’ve never understood the “it’s not about the money” argument. 

A 6 month deployment is way more tolerable when you’re making 250+ a year.  So are alllll the other problems everyone complains about. Same with the wife’s problems....

Close the pay gap with the airlines and you keep a BUNCH of pilots. But couple the known aircrew issues with literally half the pay of a 3rd year airline dude/dudette and the AF doesn’t have a chance. Not sure why this is so hard. 

Edited by pilotguy
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7 minutes ago, pilotguy said:

I’ve never understood the “it’s not about the money” argument. 

A 6 month deployment is way more tolerable when you’re making 250 a year.  So are alllll the other problems everyone complains about. Same with the wife’s problems

I can totally understand the "it's not about the money" argument, even though I don't believe many are saying it.

If someone wants something out of life that the Air Force cannot give them (e.g. control, freedom, location, accommodation of family special needs, etc.), they may not be willing to compromise merely for more money. There are some things you can't pay certain people to tolerate.

The vast majority of people I know who have left/are leaving the AF say "It's not only about the money."

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There are more AGR billets than takers right now, you just have to be willing to move to DC or some backwater staff, or not fly.

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5 hours ago, torqued said:

I can totally understand the "it's not about the money" argument, even though I don't believe many are saying it.

If someone wants something out of life that the Air Force cannot give them (e.g. control, freedom, location, accommodation of family special needs, etc.), they may not be willing to compromise merely for more money. There are some things you can't pay certain people to tolerate.

The vast majority of people I know who have left/are leaving the AF say "It's not only about the money."

There's a big gap between "it's not about the money" and "it's not ONLY about the money".

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From what I’ve seen, “It’s not about the money” argument is from people that think the AF can change the toxic $hit show it’s become. The argument of “show me the money” is typically from the people that want airline pay to put up with the BS.

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On ‎10‎/‎17‎/‎2018 at 8:19 PM, Sprkt69 said:

From what I’ve seen, “It’s not about the money” argument is from people that think the AF can change the toxic $hit show it’s become. The argument of “show me the money” is typically from the people that want airline pay to put up with the BS.

It's definitely an interesting point of view, and I'd hazard to guess that if a guy was getting paid $250k to fly fighters there'd be less of a pilot shortage. Just my 2 cents.

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It’s simple for me...

As it stands I’m 100% getting out when my time is up

If I could make 250K (approx year 3 money at an airline) in the AF I’m 100% staying in.

No, the problems don’t go away, they just can be overlooked if my time is valued properly monetarily.

Id venture to guess that most people would feel the same way. 

 

 

Edited by pilotguy
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3 hours ago, pilotguy said:

It’s simple for me...

As it stands I’m 100% getting out when my time is up

If I could make 250K (approx year 3 money at an airline) in the AF I’m 100% staying in.

No, the problems don’t go away, they just can be overlooked if my time is valued properly monetarily.

Id venture to guess that most people would feel the same way. 

 

 

Spot on.

Furthermore, the leaders who say “stay in because your country needs you” just don’t understand the dynamics. I’m 100% of my family’s father and husband population. They need me more. Until the situation is better (or at least similar) for the family when folks stay in the Air Force, most will choose to get out. That means the money has to be close.

It’s programmed into us genetically. Risk of death? Bad. Provide for kids so that they can continue to spread 50% of my genes? Good. Keeping the wife happy? See risk of death. 

It’s not selfish to pursue greener pastures. It’s selfish to stay in to satisfy ‘quality of service’ at the expense of a family.  There’s always volunteering for the Boys and Girls Club or Coast Guard auxiliary... on my brand new 30’ boat.

(Lots of caveats: some families value that quality of service as a unit, some people are psychopaths, some people don’t have families, some people didn’t bald and bloat at 35 and can get new families, etc.)

Edited by jice
Grammar
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6 hours ago, jice said:

It’s programmed into us genetically. Risk of death? Bad.

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

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13 minutes ago, Majestik Møøse said:

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

Flying an ALR extreme mission at least comes with a clear intent and a sense of satisfaction.

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21 minutes ago, Majestik Møøse said:

So here's the funny part.  While we all say we need more money to stay in and put up with the Air Force's queep, we'd also jump at the chance to volunteer for an ALR Extreme mission where we'd see a high likelihood of being killed.  Most of us have that strange self-actualization trait that makes flying into downtown Hanoi seem more desirable than living in a faceless bureaucracy.

Totally agree!

And here’s the REALLY funny part: in many circumstances that appears to be biologically programmed as well.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Price_equation

ALR extreme mission (with clear intent) = huge payoff for the ‘tribe’ = massive opportunity for propogation of similar genetic material (over the ‘tribe’ we might be sacrificing ourselves to destroy)

Sitting in a faceless bureaucracy = unhappy mate = no benefit at all to my genetic material’s propogation (through my own reproduction or opportunity for the tribe.) 

As it turns out, for beings built to fvck, it often comes down to fvcking!

(Again lots of caveats [and philosophical issues not to touch], but the issue is much more complicated than changing individual minds over and over again. In any case, more money wouldn’t hurt a bit...) 

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