The Next President is...

[MooseAg03]

Sharyl Atkisson is one of the few true journalists left. No surprise she was targeted by DOJ under Obama and they are still keeping the reasons behind their illegal tapping of her computer under wraps even with Trump in power.

If you can’t objectively look at what the intelligence apparatus has done over the past few decades and agree we have issues then I’d say you don’t give a shit about Constitutional rights. It doesn’t matter who they’re spying on or who is committing the acts, this behemoth has grown too big and something earth shattering will have to happen to cut it back to size.

http://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/388978-growing-signs-of-a-counterintelligence-operation-deployed-against-trumps

And she’s pretty hot for an older lady.

[drewpey]

On 5/23/2018 at 1:38 PM, MooseAg03 said:

Sharyl Atkisson is one of the few true journalists left. No surprise she was targeted by DOJ under Obama and they are still keeping the reasons behind their illegal tapping of her computer under wraps even with Trump in power.

If you can’t objectively look at what the intelligence apparatus has done over the past few decades and agree we have issues then I’d say you don’t give a shit about Constitutional rights. It doesn’t matter who they’re spying on or who is committing the acts, this behemoth has grown too big and something earth shattering will have to happen to cut it back to size.

http://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/388978-growing-signs-of-a-counterintelligence-operation-deployed-against-trumps

And she’s pretty hot for an older lady.

Opinion columns do not equal journalism.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and let's unpack what she has to offer us:

8 signs pointing to a counterintelligence operation deployed against Trump's campaign

1. They had a code name--what?

2. Lots of claims of surveillance against Trump people - buried lede...all were either under surveillance for Russian contacts and/or crimes being committed.

3. References national security letter abuse...from 11 years ago--somehow that shows laws were broken against Trump???

4. Unmasking--gov't officials used the system lawfully to intercept communications with monitored foreign individuals...again buried lede...you don't just say "i want to unmask all trump associated convos"...you say "this sounds nefarious...who is discussing X with Y?".  What were those conversations about?  Can you judge the unmasking without understanding the intent behind it?  You assume nefarious intent of the requester, but in reality you should be assuming nefarious intent of the people in conversation.

5. Unmasking again!  It's on the list twice...that makes it super bad!

6. Media deep state!

7. LEAKS!  The administration leaking to the media is the media's fault!  They are trying to destroy trump!  Also confounding claims the dossier was "leaked" like it was a gov't secret.

8. The FBI uses informants, so they can't be trusted!

No facts to support the conspiracy theory there was a CI op against Trump.  He was warned against Russian motives early on, ignored the advice and the Ruskies continued courting just about every aspect of the campaign and everyone lied about it.  The FBI kept a close eye on it, and as it turned out everyone had their hands in the honey pot, and now people are mad they got caught.  Why should someone go to jail for a crime someone else noticed?

[brickhistory]

Ok

 

No bleating when the right uses those impartial institutions and methods for its political gain.

[matmacwc]

Still not Hillary, and that matters, a lot.  

Edited May 27, 2018 by matmacwc

[MooseAg03]

Geez drewpey, you must have missed all the links to news articles. Like brick says, if all this is just nonsense then you’ll have no trouble during the 2020 campaign when the intel apparatus is used to spy on the democrat nominee.

It’s interesting to me that former high level intel folks are now at mainstream media outlets where they can shape the coverage of their misdeeds. The whole thing stinks and if you don’t think it does I’ve got a bridge I’d like to sell you.

[drewpey]

I looked through the links, and again no evidence...all just conjecture and very weak linking two things together to make a straw man argument.

The level of mental gymnastics you need to actually believe they were used to take down Trump is astounding.  Why wouldn't Obama just tell the FBI to kill the email investigation earlier?  Why not tell them to hold reopening it until after the elections?  Why not publically bring up Russian contacts and meddling prior to the election?  Why would the FBI privately warn the Trump campaign of possible Russian meddling?  Why would Obama warn Trump against hiring Flynn?  Sabotage doesn't make any sense no matter which direction you look at it.  If they wanted to sabotage Trump they could have a million ways, but they didn't.  The administration kept quiet and now we are finding Russians behind every rock despite repeated denials the campaign had ANY involvement with Russians.  You are right...things are starting to stink.

I honestly hope government entities are used to root out any foreign tampering in our elections regardless of party.  Particularly when there are suggestions of nefarious intent.

You can stick your head in the sand all you'd like, but ultimately there has been no evidence presented that suggests illegal activity on the government's behalf, and they have uncovered intentional illegal activity.  Even the republicans who were shown the information behind closed doors quickly walked away from the "spygate" charges.

[dream big]

Honestly I think this Russian collusion/conspiracy thing has been beat to death, on both sides.  It has been one of the biggest distractions from the real issues thanks to politics from both sides.  The public has neither the patience nor interest anymore, unless you can’t go a day without posting on Facebook how evil Trump is.  

Also, the more people try to perpetuate distractions such as Stormy Daniels (good lord who the f cares?) or Russia they are just guaranteeing Trump’s re-election. Honestly, at this point, thank god. 

[di1630]

Yep, the dems are off their f-ing rockers.

I met up with a very liberal but sane family member who was touring around Europe with her ultra-lib husband and two ultra lib couples.

She had warned me not to talk politics because how much they all hated trump. Fine by me.

We sit down at dinner in a nice European restaurant and within five minutes one of wives was talking about Trump and Russians because a Vodka based drink triggered her.

I kid you not, wacky. Out of the blue, “that sounds like a drink Trump and his best friend Putin would order.”

All dinner she kept up comments. Wasn’t sure if she was trying to get me into an argument or what but I never caved.

Finally the conversation turned to subjects like their bead art and all their issues with their adult unemployed divorced kids trying to move back home.

Dems....

[matmacwc]

Don't get me started........

They shut you down on the sly and then talked about whatever they wanted, seen this before.

Edited May 28, 2018 by matmacwc

[Sim]

For those with severe Trump Derangement Syndrome. 

 

 

[drewpey]

12 hours ago, dream big said:

Honestly I think this Russian collusion/conspiracy thing has been beat to death, on both sides.  It has been one of the biggest distractions from the real issues thanks to politics from both sides.  The public has neither the patience nor interest anymore, unless you can’t go a day without posting on Facebook how evil Trump is.  

Also, the more people try to perpetuate distractions such as Stormy Daniels (good lord who the f cares?) or Russia they are just guaranteeing Trump’s re-election. Honestly, at this point, thank god. 

For a "distraction" there sure are a lot of indictments and broken laws.  Without resorting to "whataboutism" do you care if laws were broken by members of the Trump campaign?  The "Russian conspiracy thing" is a big deal, and all sides have interest in the investigation running its course unimpeded.  America needs to be reassured the current administration is free from foreign influence, and then we can get on with business.

The video is cute...a bit rambling for my tastes though.  I noticed lots of cherry picked events, but several missing things you can't simply label as a "hoax" to paint the left as mentally deranged over the Russian issue.  I know it's fun now to spread the chasm between the left and right, but ultimately there will be a time when Trump is no longer president, and both sides will have to actually start listening to each other to do their job and make their country work.  You can't govern along the party lines forever.

[brickhistory]

The linked essay is from The Federalist, a right-leaning outlet but usually has very good contributors who write thoughtful articles.

It's editorial position does not change the facts therein.

For those who think Trump is the harbinger of the Apocalypse, please, consider both your and most of the media's positions, if you substituted "Obama" and replaced it with "Trump."

Obama shredded the Constitution, with the willingly cooperation of Congress, Republican and Democrat, and most of the media.  Those that did object publicly were shouted down with "racist."  See above for those who didn't think of him as the messiah but just a naughty boy.  (And "boy" is a Monty Python reference not a derogatory racial reference.)

Don't be shocked when the current group does it or more.

http://thefederalist.com/2018/05/29/obama-says-didnt-scandals/

 

 

Edited May 29, 2018 by brickhistory

[drewpey]

Yeah, Obama is only fooling himself when he says he didn't have scandals.  Additionally any liberal who thinks his positions were without fault wasn't paying attention.  He was fairly centrist in his positions and if you asked the left about some of his policies they would most certainly object to some of them given how the party is shifting.

I think the author's position to blame the media is ridiculous.  The media on both sides of the aisles reported on these, with their own biases as they do.  The government is established as three branches that have checks and balances against each other to establish a kalman filter of sorts for the entire country.  If you aren't happy with what the country is doing you don't blame someone who has only the power of the pen.  His complaints fall squarely onto the shoulders of congress to hold people accountable if and when there is wrongdoing...previous and current.  Things are different now because a lot of folks who were skipped the politics section of the news over the last 8+ years are now tuned in because of the drastic change in direction we've undertaken.  It drives more viewers which drives more reporting on politics.  The right looks negatively upon this and whips out the victim card, but ultimately I applaud citizens waking up and participating in the public debate of politics.  I hope it's a trend that continues well into the future.

[HeloDude]

1 hour ago, drewpey said:

Things are different now because a lot of folks who were skipped the politics section of the news over the last 8+ years are now tuned in because of the drastic change in direction we've undertaken.  

Aside from Trump's rhetoric, what are these "drastic changes" we've seen in the last 1.5 years?  Obama completely changed the healthcare industry (pretty drastic if you ask me)--what has Trump done that is so drastic?  A tax cut?  Moving our embassy to Israel?  Stepping up border enforcement (which was law well before Trump became President)?

[matmacwc]

The lefts true believers don't care about the day to day workings of this President.  He stopped their agenda, the 100 years of Obama and they didn't see it coming, well, no one did.  They probably needed 4 more years, possibly 8, to stack  the Supreme Court and it was just in their grasp.  I'd be pissed too if near leftist utopia run by a few elites was steamrolled by a shit talking New Yorker who can't put two syllables together, but of course, that's why normal folk like him.   My two cents.

[drewpey]

1 hour ago, HeloDude said:

Aside from Trump's rhetoric, what are these "drastic changes" we've seen in the last 1.5 years?  Obama completely changed the healthcare industry (pretty drastic if you ask me)--what has Trump done that is so drastic?  A tax cut?  Moving our embassy to Israel?  Stepping up border enforcement (which was law well before Trump became President)?

Trump has gone through significant efforts to undue anything Obama did...TPP, environmental protections, banking regulations, chilling of our longest and closest allies, undermining Obamacare, Paris accord, JCPOA just to name a few specifics.

From a more general standpoint I think many are concerned about the extreme polarization of politics, the balance of power and strength of our democracy, the demonization of experts, and the total disregard for truth.  

[drewpey]

2 minutes ago, matmacwc said:

run by a few elites

Trump literally shits in a golden toilet.  I get there are some "elites" on the (D) side, but I seriously can't help but chuckle every time someone wants to talk about him being a man of the people fighting against the rich and entitled.

[matmacwc]

He doesn't fight the rich and entitled, and I'm OK with that.   Shoot, I want to be one of them.  I said elites.

[Azimuth]

25 minutes ago, drewpey said:

Trump literally shits in a golden toilet.  I get there are some "elites" on the (D) side, but I seriously can't help but chuckle every time someone wants to talk about him being a man of the people fighting against the rich and entitled.

Well, if his daddy didn’t bail him out decades ago with his shitty investing, he probably wouldn’t be rich and elite.

In other news...

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/05/29/us/politics/trump-sessions-obstruction.html

Edited May 30, 2018 by Azimuth

[brickhistory]

8 hours ago, drewpey said:

Trump literally shits in a golden toilet.  I get there are some "elites" on the (D) side, but I seriously can't help but chuckle every time someone wants to talk about him being a man of the people fighting against the rich and entitled.

Indeed.  And, in my mind, one who felt most entitled, Hillary, is not in the White House.  So there's that.

But to the post at hand, then

https://hotair.com/archives/2010/04/29/obama-i-do-think-at-a-certain-point-youve-made-enough-money/    

now

http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/barack-michelle-obama-netflix-deal-1202817723/

 

Or, traveling in the way, way back machine, how a broke Barry Obama scored a really sweet real estate deal on some choice Chicago property and the guy who brokered the deal is doing time for shady real estate shenanigans.  Purely coincidental.

 

Interesting to also note the Hillary Clinton income stream has dried up since her loss.  Wonder why?

[HeloDude]

10 hours ago, drewpey said:

Trump has gone through significant efforts to undue anything Obama did...TPP, environmental protections, banking regulations, chilling of our longest and closest allies, undermining Obamacare, Paris accord, JCPOA just to name a few specifics.

From a more general standpoint I think many are concerned about the extreme polarization of politics, the balance of power and strength of our democracy, the demonization of experts, and the total disregard for truth.  

Wait...so the "drastic changes" that Trump is making is just undoing some of Obama's executive orders?  So in essence, Trump is undoing Obama's "drastic changes"?  

I get it dude--you and the other half of the country who are repulsed by Trump's rhetoricstyle and thought Hillary had this election locked up are still very upset.  But your arguments are full of emotion/opinion and little of substance...would you like to take back your "drastic changes" argument?

[TreeA10]

The problem with programs or policies enacted via a pen or a phone can be undone just as easily with a pen and a phone.  Drastic indeed.

[drewpey]

12 hours ago, brickhistory said:

Indeed.  And, in my mind, one who felt most entitled, Hillary, is not in the White House.  So there's that.

But to the post at hand, then

https://hotair.com/archives/2010/04/29/obama-i-do-think-at-a-certain-point-youve-made-enough-money/    

now

http://variety.com/2018/digital/news/barack-michelle-obama-netflix-deal-1202817723/

 

Or, traveling in the way, way back machine, how a broke Barry Obama scored a really sweet real estate deal on some choice Chicago property and the guy who brokered the deal is doing time for shady real estate shenanigans.  Purely coincidental.

 

Interesting to also note the Hillary Clinton income stream has dried up since her loss.  Wonder why?

You wouldn't be arguing in bad faith would you?  It would seem to me a Trump supporter wouldn't be bringing up someone else's shady real estate dealings or the questionable wealth of people close to the president.

 

10 hours ago, HeloDude said:

Wait...so the "drastic changes" that Trump is making is just undoing some of Obama's executive orders?  So in essence, Trump is undoing Obama's "drastic changes"?  

I get it dude--you and the other half of the country who are repulsed by Trump's rhetoricstyle and thought Hillary had this election locked up are still very upset.  But your arguments are full of emotion/opinion and little of substance...would you like to take back your "drastic changes" argument?

Not all were executive orders, but yes he is trying to undue everything Obama did.  Doing a 180 on several fronts is a drastic change.  Are you trying to say it wasn't a drastic change and Trump is just a continuation of Obama?  Sure, it's to be expected once you switch parties, but up to this point both sides have generally elected more centrist politicians, and now Trump has swung far to the right.

 

8 hours ago, TreeA10 said:

The problem with programs or policies enacted via a pen or a phone can be undone just as easily with a pen and a phone.  Drastic indeed.

I agree.  Obama did what he could with the congress he had, but ultimately that's the price of doing business in the manner he decided to.  If we see congress flip this winter I'd expect to see the sentiment reciprocated.  I can almost see the Fox News headlines now "unprecedented obstruction!" while conveniently ignoring a good portion of the Obama-era congress.

[HeloDude]

1 hour ago, drewpey said:

Not all were executive orders, but yes he is trying to undue everything Obama did.  Doing a 180 on several fronts is a drastic change.  Are you trying to say it wasn't a drastic change and Trump is just a continuation of Obama?  Sure, it's to be expected once you switch parties, but up to this point both sides have generally elected more centrist politicians, and now Trump has swung far to the right.

Again, if it's it's "drastic" to undo what Obama did then logically that means that what Obama did in the first place was also "drastic".  Unless you're just arguing that what Obama did was good and Trump undoing it is bad--which just means that you're a partisan or an ideologue, you tell me.

So once again I ask: What has Trump done that is "sooo far to the right"?  Undoing what Obama did just means we go back to pre-2008, so how is that going "far to the right" if Bush was a centrist as you say?  Be specific instead of just complaining that he is undoing Obama's executive orders, which by design, are meant to be changed with each President...because let's not pretend that the next Presifent who is a democrat won't likewise undo everything Trump has done.  Dude, I get it--you didn't vote for him and you don't like him.  

[waveshaper]

I'm not sure how many executive orders President Trump has revoked so far? He might need to up his game if he wants to compete with some of his predecessors.  

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/trump-hasnt-rolled-back-obamas-executive-orders-so-far/