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The Next President is...

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It’ll play like this. People who have never run a business/managed one: “He’s cheating the system, not even paying any taxes! Businesses are nothing more than shells for rich people.”
Everyone else who has: (looks around... then down at their 1040) “If I couldn’t write off my losses... I wouldn’t be able to employ x people, pay x each year in payroll/corporate taxes and give people a living.”
I swear, running my own business and helping a much larger one was eye opening. People don’t give a shit that Tesla/Snap/Zillow has never made a profit EVER, but God forbid if a major real estate company has ups and downs, and they write off the bad years to help them back to good ones.

Granted, I haven't read it, but NPR said $750 this morning. So if that's the case, how many bad years does a billionaire get to only pay $750?

And the Republican response is just as predictable: excuse it away.

I'm not a smart tax person, so that's as deep as I get until I talk with my very Republican accountant friend.


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At what point do you guys admit he sucks as a business man? How many bankruptcies?

Just stirring the pot here...


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11 minutes ago, slackline said:


Granted, I haven't read it, but NPR said $750 this morning. So if that's the case, how many bad years does a billionaire get to only pay $750?

And the Republican response is just as predictable: excuse it away.

I'm not a smart tax person, so that's as deep as I get until I talk with my very Republican accountant friend.


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Taxes are based on income and transactions, not net worth.  Unless you are wealthy and live in California.  

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I think the possibility of this article being factually correct is the same as its full of shit. Don’t take this to be a defense of trump, it’s not...but they could just put the tax returns out there without stating the source’s name (we already know it’s someone connected to the Manhattan DA’s office), so why don’t they? With so many political hit pieces flying around right now, the media has almost no credibility in my eyes; show me the source information/“show your work” or I put little to no stock in your claims.

If it’s all true, then it sure seems like Trump is not nailing it in business like he has claimed. But, I also know a little bit about running businesses and writing stuff off (including losses) to significantly lower tax burden is not only legal, it’s expected, and you’d be a complete dipshit to not do it. Bottom line, I remain neutral on this until info/proof beyond a MSM “source” said so.

Also, a friend talked to a lady the other day who said the reason she’s voting against trump is because he sterilizes immigrants. The news (her words) told her that; without any fact checking, especially of such an outrageous claim. For those who aren’t following, a nurse claims this is happening at ICE facilities, but for one it is alleged this has been occurring for a long time (well before trump even announced running), and two there’s no evidence (surprise surprise). Yet for Jane blow America, that headline was enough to turn her into a Biden fan. Be for a Biden/against trump all you want, but at least don’t have the bedrock of your reasoning be trash reporting from the MSM/social media.  

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Let's talk about the leak for a minute: at what point are we going to hunt down and hold people accountable for committing federal crimes because they don't like their elected officials? 

This case has 0 whistle blower implications. This was likely an sworn state AG, who released a lawfully filed tax statement with 0 incriminating information on it, because he wanted to diminish the image of the sitting President. That is a big deal IMO. We can't continue to promote a government made up of people who won't obey laws when they dislike their political leadership. Democracy will never survive that. 

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12 hours ago, Negatory said:

Haha, responses were perfect. Ad hominem my homies. Easy way out, but it's 100% what's happening.

Nothing in the way of addressing the point of the text, just baselessly attacking the person/source. Which is pretty normal when you don't know what to say in response to the actual point.

If all you can come up with is that I am "projecting" or I found my information somewhere else - or that it's no different for how republicans feel about the left (even though the point of the post is that it IS different) - then I'll assume you don't actually have a counterpoint. The sources show that groupthink happens significantly more on the right. And, based on your responses, you can't address it. Honestly, I'll bet you never get around to responding to the point of the post. You may literally even plan not to already.

And saying stuff like "Biden doesn't know Biden's policies" is about as useful as saying "Trump doesn't know Trump's policies." It's meaningless.

You're referring to the text that you got caught plagiarizing? You literally accused the conservatives here of not thinking for themselves in a post you stole from someone else... 

 

It's not that your post can't be responded to effectively, it's that no one is interested in responding to you personally. It seems like that's a bit upsetting to you, but it's well earned.

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Zero issues with legal tax avoidance. Huge issues with a guy who campaigned on his supposed business acumen, but has been floated along by daddy, bankruptcies and unethical business practices.

Also, aren’t whistleblowers, at least the ability to do so without the threat of being sent off to Siberia a staple of a good democracy? Oversimplification, I know, but you can’t have it both ways. If someone sees something wrong, and knows the supervisors, and on up the chain will continue to hide/sweep it under the rug, they have a duty to bring it to light.

I’m not saying that’s what happened here, just a general comment about your prediction of the demise of democracy because of whistleblowers...


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Zero issues with legal tax avoidance. Huge issues with a guy who campaigned on his supposed business acumen, but has been floated along by daddy, bankruptcies and unethical business practices.

Also, aren’t whistleblowers, at least the ability to do so without the threat of being sent off to Siberia a staple of a good democracy? Oversimplification, I know, but you can’t have it both ways. If someone sees something wrong, and knows the supervisors, and on up the chain will continue to hide/sweep it under the rug, they have a duty to bring it to light.

I’m not saying that’s what happened here, just a general comment about your prediction of the demise of democracy because of whistleblowers...


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1 hour ago, slackline said:


Granted, I haven't read it, but NPR said $750 this morning. So if that's the case, how many bad years does a billionaire get to only pay $750?

And the Republican response is just as predictable: excuse it away.

I'm not a smart tax person, so that's as deep as I get until I talk with my very Republican accountant friend.


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So it largely depends on how he earns “income” and how it’s set up in a tax-advantaged way. It’s not unheard of for people and companies to have so many losses than can be passed through, that they have a decade of no taxes to catch up. It’s set up in a manner to keep businesses and entrepreneurs afloat, and it’s definitely abused. But everyone does it, so that’s just the game.

In his line of work, it’s feast or famine... and the famine is deep. Look at all of the golf courses that have closed post 2009. I can believe he’s losing money every year. 

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1 hour ago, slackline said:

At what point do you guys admit he sucks as a business man? How many bankruptcies?

Just stirring the pot here...


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Interesting question. Probably when he loses everything. Business is so fluid. FedEx CEO Fred Smith famously gambled the last dollars of FedEx at a casino (and won)... and look at it now.

I think the best leg for Democrats to stand on here is the fact that he (allegedly, if the NYT is right) has personally guaranteed loans that could involve foreign parties/banks. That doesn’t look great, and we all know if we did that our TS would be gone.

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You know, I was thinking how most everyone here is college educated, and has at least a little - context.  However, reading through these comments, one would think posters are:

  • Non-military
  • High-school educated
  • Unable to move beyond (or aside from) their solid, diametrically opposed position to others
  • Inability to view recent events as an indicator (relying instead on tired old clichés)

I suppose this thread is just a reflection of reality in 2020 - but seems just sad.  Oh well, I'm off to spend some money, and enjoy a meal at a restaurant!

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38 minutes ago, GrndPndr said:

You know, I was thinking...

Pulls pin and tosses ad hominem grenade.  Walks out.

Right...Good talk, Russ.

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What gets to me is just a few years ago. All these people who now think Trump is this century’s Adolph Hitler.

Couldn’t suck up to this guy any more. They all took his money, stayed at his hotels. Played golf together. 
 

Shit they all flew on Epstein’s plane 

And The folks at NBC loved him for his hit TV show. Joe and Mika had him  on every couple of days. Basically helped get him elected.

So either it’s all an act for ratings. Or these people are really  demented.

 

 

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What gets to me is just a few years ago. All these people who now think Trump is this century’s Adolph Hitler.
Couldn’t suck up to this guy any more. They all took his money, stayed at his hotels. Played golf together. 
 
Shit they all flew on Epstein’s plane 
And The folks at NBC loved him for his hit TV show. Joe and Mika had him  on every couple of days. Basically helped get him elected.
So either it’s all an act for ratings. Or these people are really  demented.
 
 

Yeah, almost as bad as the evangelicals screaming about how he’s basically the devil, and now he’s the Savior... Or Lindsey Graham... or, you get the idea. It goes both ways.

Bottom line, politicians suck, of any flavor.


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41 minutes ago, MC5Wes said:

What gets to me is just a few years ago. All these people who now think Trump is this century’s Adolph Hitler.

Couldn’t suck up to this guy any more. They all took his money, stayed at his hotels. Played golf together. 
 

Shit they all flew on Epstein’s plane 

And The folks at NBC loved him for his hit TV show. Joe and Mika had him  on every couple of days. Basically helped get him elected.

So either it’s all an act for ratings. Or these people are really  demented.

 

 

Exactly. I don't like Donald Trump, I think he's the worst type of person. I think he lacks any sort of moral foundation, he certainly doesn't care about the issues, and he's addicted to the drug of power.

 

But the only, and I mean only difference between him and the rest of the politicians who have lived in Washington for decades is that he lacks the veneer. His shell is completely transparent, and that's why the most established characters on both sides of the aisle hate him. None of his policies are new, so it can't be that. He simply exposes to the rest of the country how completely depraved the whole enterprise is.

 

He's the first president who outwardly looks the way Washington inwardly acts. He campaigned on draining the swamp, and so the voters sent a swamp monster to clear it out. But many of the voters never truly understood what the swamp looked like until now. He's the portrait of Dorian Gray, except instead of one aristocrat, it's the entire political class.

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I think the possibility of this article being factually correct is the same as its full of shit. Don’t take this to be a defense of trump, it’s not...but they could just put the tax returns out there without stating the source’s name (we already know it’s someone connected to the Manhattan DA’s office), so why don’t they? With so many political hit pieces flying around right now, the media has almost no credibility in my eyes; show me the source information/“show your work” or I put little to no stock in your claims.
If it’s all true, then it sure seems like Trump is not nailing it in business like he has claimed. But, I also know a little bit about running businesses and writing stuff off (including losses) to significantly lower tax burden is not only legal, it’s expected, and you’d be a complete dipshit to not do it. Bottom line, I remain neutral on this until info/proof beyond a MSM “source” said so.
Also, a friend talked to a lady the other day who said the reason she’s voting against trump is because he sterilizes immigrants. The news (her words) told her that; without any fact checking, especially of such an outrageous claim. For those who aren’t following, a nurse claims this is happening at ICE facilities, but for one it is alleged this has been occurring for a long time (well before trump even announced running), and two there’s no evidence (surprise surprise). Yet for Jane blow America, that headline was enough to turn her into a Biden fan. Be for a Biden/against trump all you want, but at least don’t have the bedrock of your reasoning be trash reporting from the MSM/social media.  

Something I just thought of w/ regards to “show your work”. If Trump could, as he says, easily explain all of this away with his taxes, why doesn’t he. Do you somehow give him a pass, but a journalist has to dime out a person who could face blowback for it is bad at his job for not proving it? Why can’t Trump put all of this to bed if he’s so confident in his proof? He just makes it worse. Just a thought.


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Just now, slackline said:


Something I just thought of w/ regards to “show your work”. If Trump could, as he says, easily explain all of this away with his taxes, why doesn’t he. Do you somehow give him a pass, but a journalist has to dime out a person who could face blowback for it is bad at his job for not proving it? Why can’t Trump put all of this to bed if he’s so confident in his proof? He just makes it worse. Just a thought.


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No. There's no chance he's remotely as rich as he portrays, nor is he the businessman he claims to be. He is, I'll confess, a brilliant marketer. But I knew that going into it.

 

The best and most concise explanation I've ever read came from the Atlantic:

 

It’s a familiar split. When he makes claims like this, the press takes him literally, but not seriously; his supporters take him seriously, but not literally.

 

Liberals spend so much time agonizing over how Trump has the conservatives fooled. He's not fooling anyone. Like brabus said, it's team sports now, and Trump is wearing the right jersey.

 

You think conservatives are downplaying his insanity? You're right. They are. Liberals are currently downplaying the rising Marxist movement in their party. But his insanity is just a collection of character flaws, whereas marxism is a societal death sentence. I wish we could simultaneously denounce sociopathic character flaws and socialistic tendencies at the same time in the same political party. But you play the cards you're dealt.

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13 minutes ago, slackline said:


Something I just thought of w/ regards to “show your work”. If Trump could, as he says, easily explain all of this away with his taxes, why doesn’t he. Do you somehow give him a pass, but a journalist has to dime out a person who could face blowback for it is bad at his job for not proving it? Why can’t Trump put all of this to bed if he’s so confident in his proof? He just makes it worse. Just a thought.


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Yep, that’s valid. My guess is his ego is in the way and he’s concerned about his image as an “asskicking business man.” My opinion is he shouldn’t care, because right now his image should rest on what he produces as president (policy, etc.) That’s what he should care about. 

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Well as an Ass Kicking Business Man

He did a good job getting a Peace / Trade deal with UAE and Bahrain

Now if he could get Qatar to take the last 40 prisoners at Guantanamo 

Then he could show a commercial with Obama saying he would close  the prison on his first day in office.

 

 

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2 hours ago, slackline said:

Zero issues with legal tax avoidance. Huge issues with a guy who campaigned on his supposed business acumen, but has been floated along by daddy, bankruptcies and unethical business practices.

Also, aren’t whistleblowers, at least the ability to do so without the threat of being sent off to Siberia a staple of a good democracy? Oversimplification, I know, but you can’t have it both ways. If someone sees something wrong, and knows the supervisors, and on up the chain will continue to hide/sweep it under the rug, they have a duty to bring it to light.

I’m not saying that’s what happened here, just a general comment about your prediction of the demise of democracy because of whistleblowers...


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This specific case is not whistle blowing. There is nothing immoral, unethical or criminal on his tax returns. Embarrassing? Maybe. But embarrassing doesn't meet the threshold for whistleblower. 

Some of the other things we've seen leaked are also not whistleblowing. Policy decisions, etc... There needs to be a very clear violation of law. Not just "I think this is going to be a bad move for America and people should know about it." 

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2 hours ago, GrndPndr said:

You know, I was thinking how most everyone here is college educated, and has at least a little - context.  However, reading through these comments, one would think posters are:

  • Non-military
  • High-school educated
  • Unable to move beyond (or aside from) their solid, diametrically opposed position to others
  • Inability to view recent events as an indicator (relying instead on tired old clichés)

I suppose this thread is just a reflection of reality in 2020 - but seems just sad.  Oh well, I'm off to spend some money, and enjoy a meal at a restaurant!

Because you won't ever make any head on discussions like this in an internet forum. 

If you want to change someone's mind you can't set out to do it in the course of a conversation. You need patience and the attitude that you will change it over the course of a decade long friendship. This needs to be done in person. Everything on the internet is just venting and sport. 

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I'll throw a dog a bone here, I love that he's trying to ban tiktoc even if it's loosely based on security. Drives me batty that China is complaining. How much stuff is banned over there? They have a different internet for goodness sake! China wants it because they are stealing intellectual property left and right...


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FLEA has it right. Y'all are sounding off on a story recycled from 2016 in the ny times. Nothing new here, just another smoking gun, GOTEM.

nytimes.com/2016/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html

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FLEA has it right. Y'all are sounding off on a story recycled from 2016 in the ny times. Nothing new here, just another smoking gun, GOTEM.
nytimes.com/2016/10/02/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html

Read the news kid...


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3 hours ago, MC5Wes said:

What gets to me is just a few years ago. All these people who now think Trump is this century’s Adolph Hitler.

Couldn’t suck up to this guy any more. They all took his money, stayed at his hotels. Played golf together. 
 

Shit they all flew on Epstein’s plane 

And The folks at NBC loved him for his hit TV show. Joe and Mika had him  on every couple of days. Basically helped get him elected.

So either it’s all an act for ratings. Or these people are really  demented.

 

 

Huh! Why can't it be both?

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