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2016 UPT Board


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9 minutes ago, bb17 said:

Oh and I was approved with an age ETP - as an extra data point in case anybody was in the same situation. 

Well that is good news for me hopefully. I also had an age ETP and I turn 30 next month. I also had a second waiver for something else that I hope didn't create a problem for me.

Has anyone heard how many sponsored/unsponsored applied vs how many were selected?

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2 minutes ago, last_chance said:

Well that is good news for me hopefully. I also had an age ETP and I turn 30 next month. I also had a second waiver for something else that I hope didn't create a problem for me.

Has anyone heard how many sponsored/unsponsored applied vs how many were selected?

^this! would really like to get that stat.

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I will see if I can get permission to post the memo. It is an optional program for those who graduate from UFT before 1 Dec 16, But it doesn't sound like it is optional for the rest of us. The memo just came down a month ago and it sounds like there are a lot of unknowns about the program. Hopefully headquarters clears things up in the coming months. 

Still no news from my recruiter.

Congrats to all those currently selected! Hopefully I can join you soon.

I am replacing my previous post. Latest conversations indicate that they may attempt to implement the memo as is. There is some question of whether it is enforceable in its current form but that is the latest.

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1 hour ago, willflyforfood said:

^this! would really like to get that stat.

Got the call not to long ago and I was selected! Congrats again to everyone!

I asked my recruiter about the numbers. I didn't get a complete break down, but was told there were 36 applicants to the board. He said all sponsored applicants were selected and didn't really mention anything about unsponsored applicants. 

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20 minutes ago, last_chance said:

I uploaded a JPEG of the memo so everyone can read it. I was told nothing about the program is restricted to talk about so it shouldn't be a problem posting the memo. 

AFRC Memo.JPG

I really just don't get that. Why make people go full time for less pay. Why not just keep it as is but offer more full time spots. Don't get not paying us the traditional reservist way either. I feel like this would just make more applicants avoid the Reserves and try Active Duty of Guard.

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I imagine there are already a lot of people who would be interested in doing that without it being crammed down their throat. Probably mostly younger guys who don't have a fallback career established and are interested in having a full time job. For an older guy like myself with his own consulting practice is actually makes it an impossible proposition where AFRC gets the boot. What that means is that AFRC will probably lose a lot of applicants who have already developed extensive professional and leadership experience before applying since quitting a six figure civilian job with good benefits is not more appealing than earning $40k a year with no benefits and being stuck there for 6 years. 

However, even today I have already heard from a couple sources that this memo isn't quite what it seems. We'll see how it pans out. 

Edited by bb17
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4 minutes ago, bb17 said:

What that means is that AFRC will probably lose a lot of applicants who have already developed extensive professional and leadership experience before applying since quitting a six figure civilian job with good benefits is more appealing than earning $40k a year with no benefits and being stuck there for 6 years. 

^ This.

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On 7/14/2016 at 9:56 AM, pancho17 said:

As it stands, the 10 year commitment is for traditional reserve. This change requires you to hold an active reserve position (ART) for 6 years of your commitment. That basically translates to a full time job on base- 5 days a week.

It's not an active reserve position, (AGR), it's an Air Reserve Technician position.

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On 7/14/2016 at 10:48 AM, willflyforfood said:

Then whats the upside or point of this? 

It's a bad deal unless you are hired into a higher GS equivalent position.

 

Things to remember though, you don't have to do it unless you signed a contract stating you will. It's civilian employment.

 

 

Edit: The memo mentions GS-12 positions which means you'll make more as an ART than a TR.

Edited by LookieRookie
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You can be more active than a "1 weekend a month" guy. There are ways to double dip and make the pay worth it. You really need to do your research on this one. I know for me, prior E it's a struggle. Locality increase for a GS-9 is still under 80k for almost anywhere. Rumor has it if you take an ART position at any point you'll be released from this contract... If you're trying to go airlines and don't plan on going regionals idk what else your options are. Troughing can only get you so many hours.

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22 hours ago, GlassEmpty said:

... If you're trying to go airlines and don't plan on going regionals idk what else your options are. Troughing can only get you so many hours.

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I'm a guard bum so maybe we're coming from different areas but I get more hours (a lot more, 450ish in the past 12 months) than any of our full-timers.  And after all the deductions (insurance, bullshit retirement plan, etc) I make more or less what my ART buddies make.  Maybe I'm missing something or it's a Guard vs Reserve thing but in my mind that decision is easy in our current environment.  There are some life factors like kids or living paycheck to paycheck that may make ART more attractive but I think for most troughing is a better deal. 

As to how that plays into the bigger topic: 6 years?  Wow that's a long time.  I probably would have been ok with it when I was begging for a UPT slot but with some perspective, no way.  This is only going to reduce the quality of the applicants in the long run.  Unless as bb17 says, there is more to the story. 

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I'm a guard bum so maybe we're coming from different areas but I get more hours (a lot more, 450ish in the past 12 months) than any of our full-timers.  And after all the deductions (insurance, bullshit retirement plan, etc) I make more or less what my ART buddies make.  Maybe I'm missing something or it's a Guard vs Reserve thing but in my mind that decision is easy in our current environment.  There are some life factors like kids or living paycheck to paycheck that may make ART more attractive but I think for most troughing is a better deal. 

As to how that plays into the bigger topic: 6 years?  Wow that's a long time.  I probably would have been ok with it when I was begging for a UPT slot but with some perspective, no way.  This is only going to reduce the quality of the applicants in the long run.  Unless as bb17 says, there is more to the story. 

Well I'm new to the game and have been asking every question I can about this. The six year becomes four after you get qualified from how I'm reading this. So for airline wannabe pilot guys like me I have to calculate how long will it take for me to compile the hours for PIC and eligibility for the airlines. While posted minimum requirements may drop, that doesn't mean everyone that meets mins will get the jobs. Maybe I'm being too reserved as well as you mention avoiding paycheck to paycheck being that I have 3 deps on one paycheck for now. I have a lot to learn about troughing as well. This could also be huge in comparing fighters vs MAF.

But bottom line, taking the ART slot doesn't limit your pay if you're willing to work mil on the side and balance. I guess my bottom line is maximizing income as well as hours and finding that happy medium. If I'm missing something by all means spell it out.

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On 7/19/2016 at 7:11 AM, LookieRookie said:

It's not an active reserve position, (AGR), it's an Air Reserve Technician position.

Technically the memo says AGR or ART.

Edit: The memo itself says ART, but I got a copy of the new Memorandum of Understanding applicants are expected to sign, and it says "I understand that if selected for Undergraduate Flight Training, I agree to serve a total of six years in a full-time status. This six-year period of service will consist of Title 10 active military status for the initial formal school training courses followed by a dual-status (Title 5/Title 10) term developmental Air Reserve Technician position or in the Active Guard-Reserve (AGR) program, based on the needs of the Air Force Reserve. This six-year period of service shall commence upon entry into the first formal school training."

For those concerned about USERRA, there is a clause in there that states the five years can be extended as required to meet service requirements due to training costs, I would guess this falls under that clause. Not saying it makes it much better, but it's something.

 

1 hour ago, thankyouthanks said:

Has anyone recently selected from the June board been sworn in and received any dates? 

I'm slated for September OTS (9/14 start). I just started calling around, the 340th desk number is available on Google.

Edited by pancho17
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5 minutes ago, pancho17 said:

Technically the memo says AGR or ART. For those concerned about USERRA, there is a clause in there that states the five years can be extended as required to meet service requirements due to training costs, I would guess this falls under that clause. Not saying it makes it much better, but it's something.

 

I'm slated for September OTS (9/14 start). I just started calling around, the 340th desk number is available on Google.

Were you non prior service? I still haven't sworn in yet. Supposed to next week. 

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2 minutes ago, thankyouthanks said:

Were you non prior service? I still haven't sworn in yet. Supposed to next week. 

Yes, NPS. Was supposed to swear in last week and inprocess next week but was delayed a little with paperwork. They were ok to keep my September OTS and inprocess the week before I ship out- sounded like that was non-standard and they prefer 30 days prior. I specifically asked to be gained as quickly as possible; nice folks over there. 

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Question regarding the new temp-Art deal:

 

As a very recent UPT graduate, I will not finish my FTU for a few months, will I have to ask my unit for a baby art job? Or is it kind of implied that I will "get one if I want" based off of this memo? 

 

my my question is, does it depend on how bad the unit wants to fight for one of these jobs for new studs on their prog tour or is it thought of as a sure thing? 

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