PasserOGas Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 So, the shortage seems to be here. Our unit just got tagged for a bunch of CENTCOM lines and only about 50% of our people are volunteering. It doesn't help that AD pulled all of our MPA and Alert leaving us with nothing to feed our bums on a regular basis. There are quite a few "F*ck the AD, make them mobilize me." protesters, along with newly hired airline dudes (congrats y'all!). Squadron leadership is now mulling individual mobilizations. My question is this. What are the legalities of mobilizing a guardsman? I thought they needed the Governor or the Congress to approve this. They are making it sound like the Wing/CC can do it. Where would you find the regulations covering this? I'm somewhat new to the guard, so sorry if I should know this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10percenttruth Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) Yeah, POTUS dropped an executive order for mobilization a few days ago. Stop loss cometh. http://m.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2014/10/16/executive-order-ordering-selected-reserve-and-certain-individual-ready-r Executive Order: Ordering the Selected Reserve and Certain Individual Ready Reserve Members of the Armed Forces to Active Duty EXECUTIVE ORDER - - - - - - - ORDERING THE SELECTED RESERVE AND CERTAIN INDIVIDUAL READY RESERVE MEMBERS OF THE ARMED FORCES TO ACTIVE DUTY By the authority vested in me as President by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including sections 121 and 12304 of title 10, United States Code, I hereby determine that it is necessary to augment the active Armed Forces of the United States for the effective conduct of Operation United Assistance, which is providing support to civilian-led humanitarian assistance and consequence management support related to the Ebola virus disease outbreak in West Africa. In furtherance of this operation, under the stated authority, I hereby authorize the Secretary of Defense, and the Secretary of Homeland Security with respect to the Coast Guard when it is not operating as a service in the Navy, under their respective jurisdictions, to order to active duty any units, and any individual members not assigned to a unit organized to serve as a unit of the Selected Reserve, or any member in the Individual Ready Reserve mobilization category and designated as essential under regulations prescribed by the Secretary concerned, and to terminate the service of those units and members ordered to active duty. This order is not intended to, and does not, create any right or benefit, substantive or procedural, enforceable at law or in equity by any party against the United States, its departments, agencies, or entities, its officers, employees, or agents, or any other person. BARACK OBAMA THE WHITE HOUSE, October 16, 2014. Edited October 29, 2014 by 10percenttruth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PasserOGas Posted October 29, 2014 Author Share Posted October 29, 2014 I thought this only applied to reservists. Aren't there more levels of "protection" for guardsmen since we belong to the state? Still wondering about a governing reg. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 I thought this only applied to reservists. Aren't there more levels of "protection" for guardsmen since we belong to the state? Still wondering about a governing reg. Not sure about a governing reg but it is governed by 10 USC Sections 12302 and 12304, IIRC. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matmacwc Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 Reserves are title 10, ANG is "generally" title 32. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted October 29, 2014 Share Posted October 29, 2014 (edited) Reserves are title 10, ANG is "generally" title 32. You are correct except when Reserve and ANG forces are ordered to active duty (mobilized), the authority derives from the sections of 10 USC I mentioned above, among others. ETA: http://www.ngaus.org/sites/default/files/Guard%20Statues.pdf Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Edited October 29, 2014 by Herk Driver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialD Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It's only going to get worse my friend. It's even better when they deploy Guard squadrons to NON contingency locations in the "AEF." Works good until your part timers hit their 5 year mil leave limit. These orders are not USERRA exempt...so theoretically, their employers do not have keep their job for them. I think you're going to see a lot more guys say no...mobilize me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvlax40 Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It's only going to get worse my friend. It's even better when they deploy Guard squadrons to NON contingency locations in the "AEF." Works good until your part timers hit their 5 year mil leave limit. These orders are not USERRA exempt...so theoretically, their employers do not have keep their job for them. I think you're going to see a lot more guys say no...mobilize me. Does USERRA explicitly state what orders are and are not exempt (honest question, im a newb) and can guard guys really say no to mobilizing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marco Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 He means "no" to volunteering. Mobilize me = federally activate me if you want me to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Also note Tricare is now not paying 6 months retroactive to orders. Benefits start on orders start date. Another cost saving measure at the member's expense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hindsight2020 Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 It's only going to get worse my friend. It's even better when they deploy Guard squadrons to NON contingency locations in the "AEF." Works good until your part timers hit their 5 year mil leave limit. These orders are not USERRA exempt...so theoretically, their employers do not have keep their job for them. I think you're going to see a lot more guys say no...mobilize me. If mobilization is a threat for the unit in question, any individual member would be a fool to volunteer for duty which would be not USERRA exempt. The notable exception being bums/troughers. So in all reality, the mobilization issue is self-correcting.Uncle Sam will have to pay through the nose for the mobi's as they will generally NOT volunteer. The real impact of the mobi's is the post-deployment manning. Guys historically punch right after enduring these non-vols, especially the more senior airline guys who were merely coasting for retirement points/furlough protection and otherwise endure a quantifiable paycut while on AD. Situations such as these generally create a flush manning-wise as they return to essentially drop retire papers. Frankly I'd be more worried about catching ebola than the whole econ/QOL hit due to the invol mob. As to individual mobis, watch out, that can get political within a unit real quick. Playing favorites et al and all the things that make ARC incestuous leadership an infamous stereotype, particularly in the Guard side of the ARC where good ol' boy/townie dynamics are more prevalent. Good luck to all those affected. #Getpaid. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p9aXaeheYFw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 We were just briefed (literally, briefly - the questions [with no good answers] that followed lasted far longer than the initial announcement) about these changes this past weekend. The new AEF construct plays into this as well. Big Blue and Uncle Sugar are in for a rude awakening if they think they're gonna get the same level of AFRC/ANG volunteerism for 6-month deployments, if there's no USERRA protection for volunteers. I can't think of many people who would willingly throw away their civilian jobs/careers in order to deploy to JATWISH for 6 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Noonin Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Big Blue and Uncle Sugar are in for a rude awakening if they think they're gonna get the same level of AFRC/ANG volunteerism for 6-month deployments, if there's no USERRA protection for volunteers. I can't think of many people who would willingly throw away their civilian jobs/careers in order to deploy to JATWISH for 6 months. USERRA protects you, volunteer or not. Did someone tell you otherwise? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dvlax40 Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 USERRA protects you, volunteer or not. Did someone tell you otherwise? i believe earlier in the thread it was stated that it ws USERRA exempt. I had questions about that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 USERRA protects you, volunteer or not. Did someone tell you otherwise? Yes. We were briefed by a reputable source, on G-series orders, that USERRA protection for AFRC deployment volunteers is on the chopping block. The brief was short on explanations. Needless to say, the feedback was immediate and negative (the basic sentiment was, "You want me? Mobilize me. Otherwise, GFY."). Whether that feedback makes a difference, or if it's a done deal already, remains to be seen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Noonin Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 i believe earlier in the thread it was stated that it ws USERRA exempt. I had questions about that. USERRA exempt does not mean it's unprotected. It means that it doesn't count against your 5 year cumulative mil leave limit. Yes. We were briefed by a reputable source, on G-series orders, that USERRA protection for AFRC deployment volunteers is on the chopping block. The brief was short on explanations. Needless to say, the feedback was immediate and negative (the basic sentiment was, "You want me? Mobilize me. Otherwise, GFY."). Whether that feedback makes a difference, or if it's a done deal already, remains to be seen. Interesting. I personally cannot see congress changing the law but who knows. As for mobilizations, I think they are going to be common from now on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialD Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 USERRA exempt does not mean it's unprotected. It means that it doesn't count against your 5 year cumulative mil leave limit.This. USERRA specifically states what orders are exempt. It all has to do with how your orders are coded (which codes are written into USERRA). Interesting. I personally cannot see congress changing the law but who knows.As for mobilizations, I think they are going to be common from now on.I agree on both accounts. I can't see the law changing to have fewer types of orders protected. If anything, it had better get changed to add in some of these newer "deployments" that are to non-contingency locations.The Guard is not meant to deploy for 6 months on a regular basis. I can guarantee you as these type deployments become common place, the awesome retention rates that the ANG has enjoyed for so long, will quickly go away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JarheadBoom Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 Dunno how (if at all) this affects the ANG, but AFRC, in their quest to become AD-Lite, has fully embraced 6-month full-unit deployments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokin Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 So if they put out a request for volunteers for a non-contingency deployment, no one volunteers, and they mobilize someone, does that mobilization become USERRA exempt? For example, if a unit picks a dude who has burned 4 years and 7 months of his USERRA time and they mobilize him after he didn't volunteer, can he get fired from his other job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go Falcons Posted November 1, 2014 Share Posted November 1, 2014 What units or airframes are being mobilized? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vertigo Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 What units or airframes are being mobilized? How many tanks do you have and where are they located? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Go Falcons Posted November 3, 2014 Share Posted November 3, 2014 How many tanks do you have and where are they located? Hahaha... I bet you Ace'd your OPSEC CBT; however, PasserOGas failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PasserOGas Posted November 3, 2014 Author Share Posted November 3, 2014 (edited) Hahaha... I bet you Ace'd your OPSEC CBT; however, PasserOGas failed. I passed, but then again I only remember a flurry of mouse clicks followed by a certificate. As for retention, a handful of guys in my unit are approaching their 10 years/retirement date and are going to punch. I'm on the fence. I loved my short time in the guard, but if this is going to be the new normal I'll probably be putting in my walking papers as well. Edited November 3, 2014 by PasserOGas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F16Rooster Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 Sigh, why can't we just go back to the rainbow. God forbid we use the system that has been sustainable for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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