Spaceballs Posted April 3, 2014 Share Posted April 3, 2014 Is there any kind of pre-test available to study before taking the tests? I'm working on the first class right now and so much of it is "this person you've never heard of said this, but oh yeah this other person you've never heard of said this". I'm afraid the test is going to be a bunch of questions about the first commander's opinion of an unheard of AETC wing on critical thinking...just stuff that no one really cares about. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravedigger Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 "Stop doing SOS in correspondence, unless you are past the window to go in-residence." - Gen Welsh and Lt Gen Cox Also, I have no idea what the fuck you are talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverwolf0911 Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 The first test didn't have any kind of review questions or anything. I had to actually read/skim it to pass the test. I don't remember the questions being obscure... Most were pretty common sense. Test 2 and 3 had review questions. I suggest you skip the lessons and go straight for these. And keep refreshing the page because it presents you with new questions... After a few refreshes, you pretty much see all of them. The tests were almost word for word the same questions as these review ones. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 I suggest you skip the lessons and go straight for these. And keep refreshing the page because it presents you with new questions... After a few refreshes, you pretty much see all of them. The tests were almost word for word the same questions as these review ones. Copy, PME still worthless. Bendy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustache Sally Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Agree with Bendy. As long as we keep submitting to the AF task masters' long list of demands, nothing will change. I had a meeting with my sqdn CC this morning about assignments and he asked me about the status of my SOS correspondence. I respectfully told him I wasn't going to do it and gave him my very logical reasons. Since I have a good reputation throughout the wing as an honest, hard worker, I think he took me seriously. He also admitted to me that he in fact did not do correspondence either. I'm sure you have lots of real work to do, so take care of the mission, your family, and yourself. Those things are REQUIRED. SOS online is not. There's no time left over for nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravedigger Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Dudes, I'm trying to help you out. Straight from CSAF and A1, do not do correspondence if you still have eligibility to go in-residence. SOS will be 5 weeks starting in the Fall to accommodate more classes. You won't even be able to register for correspondence unless you are at 7 years and can't go in-residence. If your Wings haven't gotten this guidance yet, have them call the NAF/MAJCOM/HAF. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Gravedigger speaks truth. Stop doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liquid Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Confirmed. I heard it directly from Lt Gen Cox yesterday and CSAF today. No need to do in correspondence unless you are unable to attend in residence. Goal is 100% in residence. In the near future you will not be able to enroll unless you are past your eligibility period and have not attended. I would not complete another lesson. Formal message and guidance will be released soon. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theSituation Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 So, this is probably a dumb question, but if I've already done the old online course do I have to go in res? Follow up: if I've already completed it online, does that put me on a lower priority to go in res? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 So, this is probably a dumb question, but if I've already done the old online course do I have to go in res? Follow up: if I've already completed it online, does that put me on a lower priority to go in res? It's far from a dumb question. The answer is yes, you still need to go in-residence. The distance learning course is not the same as going in residence (arguably more valuable as can be gleaned by the example above), the exact value of going in-residence is debatable and fortunately beside the point. Having completed PME by correspondence shouldn't put you at a disadvantage to attend in-residence. This would be a pretty huge 180 and a major party foul for leadership; the intent is for you to go. Only should the opportunity not present itself (i.e. you are too busy fighting a war, those article 15's keep getting in the way) would you not go. The team building, networking, and pure opportunity for collaborative/vicarious learning is enough of a reason to send everyone (despite the rigidity and cost). As it is, it isn't doing what we need it to be doing...we can't have you out there just memorizing review questions and "control-F'ing" your way to a leadership position, now can we? Bendy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
F16Deuce Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Don't bother doing SOS in correspondence. It's a waste of your time, much like SOS in residence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xaarman Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) Wing leadership here is saying that SOS cadre can say that as much as they want, but until they hear some official guidance, SOS in corres is required to show you want to go in residence. Announcement was made at the Flight Commanders course we were all voluntold to attend earlier this month. I can provide specifics if needed. Edited April 4, 2014 by xaarman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 So first hand information from the CSAF and other generals isn't good enough for your wing leadership? Cool. The official guidance had been out for months in the form of a verbal order from CSAF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobby Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Wing leadership here is saying that SOS cadre can say that as much as they want, but until they hear some official guidance, SOS in corres is required to show you want to go in residence. Announcement was made at the Flight Commanders course we were all voluntold to attend earlier this month. I can provide specifics if needed. And the cycle continues. Posted from the NEW Baseops.net App! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Majestik Møøse Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 What gravedigger said. Starting in October, SOS won't even let you register for correspondence unless you're 2 years prior to your major board. According to them, locking it out is the only way they can keep local CCs from using it as a differentiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Wing leadership here is saying that SOS cadre can say that as much as they want, but until they hear some official guidance, SOS in corres is required to show you want to go in residence. Announcement was made at the Flight Commanders course we were all voluntold to attend earlier this month. I can provide specifics if needed. So from what I am reading here and from what Liquid and Majestik said, if you are not within 2 years of your Majors board and have not yet gone in residence, then drag your feet until 1 Oct. Try to enroll and when denied enrollment make sure you tell your boss that you cannot enroll. If you are denied residence based upon that then you have other avenues of recourse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 SOS != IDE or SDE. IDE and SDE selects are prohibited from enrolling in correspondence. In Oct, Captains will be prohibited from enrolling in SOS until after 7 years TAFCS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bender Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Stuff on IDE/SDE... This stuff seems as legit as a PDSM can be, but be careful not to compare apples to oranges. SOS does not have a "DE" or "Select" process. This makes "locking out" IDE and SDE smaller in scope than SOS (BDE, I believe) with a 100% attendance goal. This is a logical first step at implementing the CSAF's guidance. There will need to be some mechanism in place to trigger the 7 year TAFCS enrollment window...if the intent is to truly deny enrollment, rather than simply discourage it (criticisms of which are valid). Bendy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panchbarnes Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) Wing leadership here is saying that SOS cadre can say that as much as they want, but until they hear some official guidance, SOS in corres is required to show you want to go in residence. This was the exact same message I received 3 years ago from higher level leadership when SOS was publicly touted as 100% in-residence. I even called the civilian SOS director to confirm the 100% policy. He was frustrated then that commanders were not abiding by the guidance. My current leadership still believes you must do by-correspondence to be considered for in-residence. This is why unofficial guidance (for positive things) does not work in the military, no matter how cool it sounds. "Inertia" Edited April 4, 2014 by PanchBarnes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Herk Driver Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 Words about IDE/SDE Note the topic of the thread. Note the responses all deal with SOS. Note that one of these things is not like the others. Back to the topic at hand... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustache Sally Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 The "requirement" by management to do correspondence before going in-res sounds like a slam-dunk IG complaint to me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BB Stacker Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 The "requirement" by management to do correspondence before going in-res sounds like a slam-dunk IG complaint to me! Good luck with that. There's no published policy, and AFAIK it's not like the CSAF has had an all call with all the WG/CC's where he explicitly informed them in person of the new policy...even though anyone with half a brain knows the CSAF's intent, until it's published, you won't have anything to substantiate the complaint. It's a sad comment on the complete dysfunctional and broken nature of this clown show of a service that the HMFWIC can't get something this simple done without first publishing a policy letter and ensuring it is distributed in triplicate. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panchbarnes Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) The "requirement" by management to do correspondence before going in-res sounds like a slam-dunk IG complaint to me! Just something to think about before you even mention the word IG. Have you exhausted all options to resolve the issue at the lowest level? And is this issue really worthy of an IG complaint? (How have you suffered as a result of this requirement?) I agree this requirement is dumb but I don't think it's a "slam-dunk" IG complaint. Edited April 4, 2014 by PanchBarnes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustache Sally Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) There's no published policy that correspondence is a prerequisite, either. In my wing, they still preach the "correspondence is a must" but the reality is, they will send--and have sent--people who have not done the online version before they will ever give back the slot. Part of what I told my CC in our meeting was I have a really tough time justifying doing it when we have sent people straight to in-res who do not even do half the work I do on a daily basis and are considered "behind their peers" on all fronts. So the hard workers/high achievers have to do more work while the typical lazy asses get to skate by yet again. This may not be the case in other wings but it is definitely the case here. I understand that going to the IG is a ballzy move and you'd better bring your A-game...it is not something to take lightly. But I have a hunch that just a whiff of someone going to the IG with this would get management scrambling, at least in my neck of the woods. Especially if people like me (with a clean paper trail, no skeletons in the closet, a good reputation, and a strong performance record) launch the complaint if ultimately denied the chance to go in-res, it gives the complaint some teeth. It may blow up in the end and have negative consequences, but I will accept that. Better to fight the good fight than live my life succumbing to every absurd demand the AF makes--especially demands will no real reg or written policy to back it up. Panch--I'm not going down that road currently and don't need to (I'm a first-year Capt). I would absolutely try to resolve the situation at the lowest level before taking drastic measures. I'm just speaking hypothetically, as though someone was at the point of their "last look" to go before their majors board. Edited April 4, 2014 by Mustache Sally 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panchbarnes Posted April 4, 2014 Share Posted April 4, 2014 (edited) I understand that going to the IG is a ballzy move and you'd better bring your A-game...it is not something to take lightly. But I have a hunch that just a whiff of someone going to the IG with this would get management scrambling, at least in my neck of the woods. Especially if people like me (with a clean paper trail, no skeletons in the closet, a good reputation, and a strong performance record) launch the complaint if ultimately denied the chance to go in-res, it gives the complaint some teeth. It may blow up in the end and have negative consequences, but I will accept that. Better to fight the good fight than live my life succumbing to every absurd demand the AF makes--especially demands will no real reg or written policy to back it up. Obviously your dream has not been crushed yet... j/k (sort of) You don't have to go SOS in-res you know. But I do think your IG suggestion brings up a good question: Is SOS In-res really about training/professional development or is it really about a promotion indicator? Edited April 4, 2014 by PanchBarnes 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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