Spaceballs Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 So the new USAF captain board just posted their results and many of us believe there were some mistakes made. There are people who were wash backs in flight school who got promoted and others who graduated in the top half of their flight school class and top of their FTU class who were nonselected. There is a certain airframe in which everyone at that schoolhouse when the packages were sent in was nonselected. My understanding is that a promotion board cannot discriminate based on the job. A promotion board has to select based on job performance while a retention board can discriminate based on the job. Maybe there was a paperwork issue out of that FTU? Has anyone had experience on how to appeal a promotion board and what steps to take? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialD Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 There is always the IG option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17D_guy Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Call/write your congressman/senator like some drone folks did? Also, look up the AFI and give it a good scrub. There should be something in there covering it. However I think your options are, unfortunatly, limited. I really am disgusted with how the Air Force is handling air crew in this. Is it just that there's not a lot of rated on the promotion boards? I thought a rated officer was the president. Are they not aware of what's going on in the pipelines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BQZip01 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) I have not personally had that experience, but I do know someone who was in the EXACT same situation solely because the FTU opted to submit a blank PRF (WTF!?!). Even in that situation, where someone was completely negligent in their official duties, he was not able to appeal it. If you want POC info, please PM me. FWIW, he made 1 Above the zone the following year with flying colors Edited October 7, 2012 by BQZip01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HuggyU2 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Submit your rationale to the AF Board for the Correction of Military Records. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theat6bisasham Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Apparently a bunch of dudes didn't get promoted at our FTU here. Insane, these kids just graduated pilot and navigator training, and are already in training in their MWS and big blue decides they don't get promoted, while shoe clerks who were planning the xmas party made it...it's the end of the USAF it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BQZip01 Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) Apparently a bunch of dudes didn't get promoted at our FTU here. Insane, these kids just graduated pilot and navigator training, and are already in training in their MWS and big blue decides they don't get promoted, while shoe clerks who were planning the xmas party made it...it's the end of the USAF it seems. This is a trend item...probably not really important... Those guys in a "Training Unit" are probably just washbacks who haven't made it after 7 years...it's probably time to cut them loose Edited October 7, 2012 by BQZip01 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
moosepileit Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Nothing says you cannot get some help and put into the Board for the Corrections as Huggy said AND let you chain of Command and IG know that you are going to your Congressmen for an inquiry request. You do NOT have to let the IG and chain know, but it is polite. They may ask you to wait on the Board, they may even help you with the board submittal. You do NOT have to wait for the board process. The more that do this, both at your installation and in general, the better. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
backseatdriver Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 (edited) This is a trend item...probably not really important... Those guys in a "Training Unit" are probably just washbacks who haven't made it after 7 years...it's probably time to cut them loose Dude - they're talking about the CAPTAIN promotion board. What FTU had a 100% non-select rate? Theres no way a group of dudes who made it through UPT/UNT can ALL somehow be in the bottom 5% of their year group. Calling shenanigans. Edited October 7, 2012 by backseatdriver Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceballs Posted October 7, 2012 Author Share Posted October 7, 2012 No. There is a 100% nonselection with at least one FTU. I know because I am a part of it. Almost everyone that dropped this airframe was in the top half of their classes out of Pensacola. That is why we believe there is some sort of mistake that occurred. We are hoping it was a paperwork issue, maybe an incomplete package or something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravedigger Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 Were you given a PRF signed by your Wing Commander? What was the overall recommendation? If it was a P, you should have had 5 lines of bullets. If it was a DP, you made Captain. Did you get an Officer Pre-Selection Brief (OPB) and verify that all of your info was correct? Good luck to you guys, this is a shitty process that has hurt a lot of good people. In the worst-case scenario, if you don't get any resolution this year, you should be fine next year 1 APZ. I know that sucks, but your career isn't over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edfsr Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 This addresses individual non-selection, not squadron wide buffoonery: Contact the promotion board section at AFPC and get a copy of your record 'As Met' - it's what the board saw. Schedule a 'Non-Select Counseling' appointment and invite your CC to it. Someone from AFPC will go over your record with you (via telephone) and look for errors and offer clues to your non-selection. If there are any errors or something is missing they will tell you how to fix it (may require an appeal to the Board for Corrections of Military Records) and you'll be able to have your record go before a Special Selection Board. If you get picked up from that board it will be the same as if you were promoted from the original board. If not, no harm done. If you don't have cause for the SSB route they will provide advice for strengthening your record for your APZ board. Look around the Promotion section of the MyPers website for phone numbers and more info. Best of luck. 10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HU&W Posted October 7, 2012 Share Posted October 7, 2012 This addresses individual non-selection, not squadron wide buffoonery: Contact the promotion board section at AFPC and get a copy of your record 'As Met' - it's what the board saw. Schedule a 'Non-Select Counseling' appointment and invite your CC to it. Someone from AFPC will go over your record with you (via telephone) and look for errors and offer clues to your non-selection. If there are any errors or something is missing they will tell you how to fix it (may require an appeal to the Board for Corrections of Military Records) and you'll be able to have your record go before a Special Selection Board. If you get picked up from that board it will be the same as if you were promoted from the original board. If not, no harm done. If you don't have cause for the SSB route they will provide advice for strengthening your record for your APZ board. Look around the Promotion section of the MyPers website for phone numbers and more info. Best of luck. Great first post. Welcome to the forums. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaceballs Posted October 7, 2012 Author Share Posted October 7, 2012 That's great info. Thanks a lot. I'm going to talk to my sq/cc first thing Tuesday morning about what happened and I'll still go through these steps either way. If something was screwed up, this process should catch it. Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nineline Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) No. There is a 100% nonselection with at least one FTU. Now I'm curious. Which FTU? Or is that "close hold" info? -9- Edited October 8, 2012 by Nineline Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty-six & Two Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 In the worst-case scenario, if you don't get any resolution this year, you should be fine next year 1 APZ. I know that sucks, but your career isn't over. Only 47% were promoted above the zone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drewpey Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Now I'm curious. Which FTU? Or is that "close hold" info? -9- Shouldn't be a secret...pretty damn important information for the next years captains board... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravedigger Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Only 47% were promoted above the zone. Which is a very high percentage as far as promotions go, even higher when you factor out the folks with QFIs. I worked the PRFs for all of our OG Lts this year, and the people that got passed over last year when they shouldn't have been got promoted APZ. The Lts that shouldn't have been promoted weren't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fifty-six & Two Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Which is a very high percentage as far as promotions go, even higher when you factor out the folks with QFIs. I worked the PRFs for all of our OG Lts this year, and the people that got passed over last year when they shouldn't have been got promoted APZ. The Lts that shouldn't have been promoted weren't. Absolutely, especially compared to other boards where it is usually less than 5% APZ. It just sucks for these guys who have to wait even though they may not have done a single thing wrong. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gravedigger Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 (edited) It just sucks for these guys who have to wait even though they may not have done a single thing wrong. Completely agree. Like I said, this entire process is bullshit. A couple more things for those out there that might be going up for a Capt board in the future. If you will have 120 days of supervision before the cutoff date, you need to request/demand a draft OPR. You can build a PRF using a draft OPR, as long as it will closeout before the cutoff. Also, any work you do on casual, get an LOE. You can use the bullets from your LOE on your first OPR (if you don't have better stuff to pull from) and more importantly, your training unit can put LOE bullets on your 475. Bullets from 475s can be used on PRFs just like an OPR. This Capt board is forcing everyone to take the first couple of years a lot more seriously; you can help yourself by knowing what to ask for and what you are owed. Edited October 8, 2012 by Gravedigger 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cap-10 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Another tid-bit: Your rater is supposed to give you your PRF NLT 30 days prior to the board commencing...this is supposed to give you time to review in case of errors (and submit any letters to the board). For those that were passed over and you saw your PRF < 30 days prior (or didn't see it at all), make sure that is brough up during your appeal process. I'll try to find the AFI reference and repost later. Best of luck to you guys! Cheers, Cap-10 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karl Hungus Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 A couple more things for those out there that might be going up for a Capt board in the future. If you will have 120 days of supervision before the cutoff date, you need to request/demand a draft OPR. And that's bullshit too. Yeah, let's give newly winged aviators even more non-mission related BS to worry about. Seriously, I don't at all understand why anyone would want to stay in this service. It's a fucking disaster. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duece123 Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Thank god I am in the guard. Just make sure finance knows and boom, I am a captain. No paperwork, board, etc. I do A bullshit OPR once a year that no one takes seriously. I sympathize with you guys, too much queep bs on AD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
herkbum Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Thank god I am in the guard. Just make sure finance knows and boom, I am a captain. No paperwork, board, etc. I do A bullshit OPR once a year that no one takes seriously. I sympathize with you guys, too much queep bs on AD. Nice try, but there is more to it than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialD Posted October 8, 2012 Share Posted October 8, 2012 Thank god I am in the guard. Just make sure finance knows and boom, I am a captain. No paperwork, board, etc. I do A bullshit OPR once a year that no one takes seriously. I sympathize with you guys, too much queep bs on AD. Come on dude, don't be THAT Guard guy! Don't worry my friend, the queep/bs spigot has turned from slow drip to a steady stream, and is only getting worse. I have seen my OPRs go from what you have described above, to shit that would water any boards eyes. Total BS, but apparently someone is taking note and the shit is becoming more important. We have our fair share of BS, just a different flavor of BS! It probably won't get any better when we all receive our AD TFI guys here in a year or so. Times....they are a changin'! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now