Miles Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) havent gotten my ead yet, Im set to commission in May. Edited January 25, 2012 by Miles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
so.it.goes Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 havent gotten my ead yet, Im set to commission in May. AMS or OTS? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LookieRookie Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 (edited) Just a note to all the people with zero time, you can do it. A few people in my flight and I had absolutely no time before we arrived to IFS and we made it through. You just have to be aware that during the week you aren't going to television or Facebook much, if at all. We were either in the flight room studying the local flying procedures, drawing out our profiles, or chair flying the hell out of our profiles in the cockpit trainer. That's the biggest thing you should be doing, chair flying. I chair flew (ie simulated flying) more hours than I actually flew, but that's what gets you proficient. As well, make sure you chair fly the pattern and all the required maneuvers. Oh and be a hardass when you're critiquing your buddy that's chair flying as the student. You aren't doing him any favors by letting him forget things that his IP will ding him on. Edited January 25, 2012 by LookieRookie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Noonin Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 You just have to be aware that during the week you aren't going to television or Facebook much, if at all. Say it ain't so! My, how times have changed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 AMS or OTS? ROTC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeagleWeagle Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 ROTC Haha then you've most likely got plenty of time before you'll be at IFS. I commissioned LAST May and I've still got another month or so to wait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzz Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Haha then you've most likely got plenty of time before you'll be at IFS. I commissioned LAST May and I've still got another month or so to wait. Or you could be like me who commissioned May 7th, EAD'd on the 9th with RNLT of the 12th and was at IFS by the end of the month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoomieRugby Posted January 26, 2012 Share Posted January 26, 2012 Regarding the aircraft similarities, there are many. And, yes, having experience in the 40 can help you in the 20. The real question comes down to what you were taught in the 40 and what you were expected to do. If the experience came from Powered Flight at the Academy or anywhere else, realize we are going to ask you to fly the 20 in a specific manner....consistently....rather than some type of program that is more "orientation" in nature. Not a hit on the Powered Flight Program if that applies. Rather, a statement of fact that the two are not equal and have totally different mission objectives. Smokey Yes my DA-40 experience (about 10 hours and some solo) came from USAFA and I also have about 30 hours in 172s. I agree that PFP seems more orientation, as it is offered to almost anyone here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted January 27, 2012 Author Share Posted January 27, 2012 LOL i like this smokey, may have to hold you to that when our class comes through sir. ;) I'm more than game. Please, prove me wrong on the bet. Let me know what the class is and I'll even have the Chief Pilot validate the success/failure. Good Luck! Smokey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 I'm more than game. Please, prove me wrong on the bet. Let me know what the class is and I'll even have the Chief Pilot validate the success/failure. Good Luck! Smokey Sounds good however, i've heard about previous classes so i wouldnt be surprised if my class did the same once we got there but it would be awesome if we did get it right the first day. Or you could be like me who commissioned May 7th, EAD'd on the 9th with RNLT of the 12th and was at IFS by the end of the month. Wow, talk about a quick turn around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peteflyer105 Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Wondering if anyone can answer this question. The Boldface and ops limits for the DA-20 posted on the pre-arrival guide off the dossifs.com website, are they changed every month or annualy?I plan on studying them now before I go to IFS in 3 months, but I want to make sure they wont change the information anytime soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archa3opt3ryx Posted January 27, 2012 Share Posted January 27, 2012 Wondering if anyone can answer this question. The Boldface and ops limits for the DA-20 posted on the pre-arrival guide off the dossifs.com website, are they changed every month or annualy?I plan on studying them now before I go to IFS in 3 months, but I want to make sure they wont change the information anytime soon. Good questions, I'd like to know too. Also, Smokey, don't know if you can answer this, but what is the format of the BF/OL test? It is exactly like the tables they give you in the arrival guide, but with the operations or numbers blanked out? Like, we'll get a piece of paper that says "Engine fire on the ground, Electrical fire on the ground", etc, then we write in "Fuel Shutoff Valve - Off, Cabin Heat - Off" under it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LookieRookie Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Good questions, I'd like to know too. Also, Smokey, don't know if you can answer this, but what is the format of the BF/OL test? It is exactly like the tables they give you in the arrival guide, but with the operations or numbers blanked out? Like, we'll get a piece of paper that says "Engine fire on the ground, Electrical fire on the ground", etc, then we write in "Fuel Shutoff Valve - Off, Cabin Heat - Off" under it? Yes. And make sure you write exactly how it is in the paper. The "I" should be a straight line not a roman numeral Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H-10btr Posted January 28, 2012 Share Posted January 28, 2012 Wondering if anyone can answer this question. The Boldface and ops limits for the DA-20 posted on the pre-arrival guide off the dossifs.com website, are they changed every month or annualy?I plan on studying them now before I go to IFS in 3 months, but I want to make sure they wont change the information anytime soon. I wouldn't worry about them changing in 3 months. Even if they did it wouldn't be more than 1 number or so. But in reality I wouldn't start studying 3 months out either. It took me 30 minutes one day to memorize it all then 10 minutes a couple days in a row to review what I memorized. Yes. And make sure you write exactly how it is in the paper. The "I" should be a straight line not a roman numeral I havn't been to IFS yet but after talking to some buddies who just took the test they gave me a few tips like that one: 1) The fuel capacity is "24.0" not "24" 2) For the BF remember to write it out in all capital letters. 3) AIRSPEED - 60 "KIAS" not "KTS" or "KNOTS" 4) FLAPS - "LDG" not "LANDING" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuzz Posted January 29, 2012 Share Posted January 29, 2012 (edited) I'm more than game. Please, prove me wrong on the bet. Let me know what the class is and I'll even have the Chief Pilot validate the success/failure. Good Luck! Smokey I think you're safe Smokey, I thought my class would do alright since we had a ton of older guys or cross-overs from other parts of big blue, but alas still took almost a week. Miles, it doesn't matter if you know it all it takes is one person to screw it up and you are done, and if you honestly think that all 100 or so (120 in my class), can get that thing right; you have more faith in humanity than I do. Sounds good however, i've heard about previous classes so i wouldnt be surprised if my class did the same once we got there but it would be awesome if we did get it right the first day. Wow, talk about a quick turn around. Yep was a helmet fire trying to figure out how the AF worked let alone pilot training, oh and I got back from IFS and they bumped me up two UPT classes. Looking back now, I don't regret it, I'll (Lord willing) be winging in 7 months, and on with my career as a 2nd Lt. with one year in versus some other guys in my class who will be 1st Lts/almost Capts. Edited January 29, 2012 by Scaredfuzz21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I think you're safe Smokey, I thought my class would do alright since we had a ton of older guys or cross-overs from other parts of big blue, but alas still took almost a week. Miles, it doesn't matter if you know it all it takes is one person to screw it up and you are done, and if you honestly think that all 100 or so (120 in my class), can get that thing right; you have more faith in humanity than I do. Yep was a helmet fire trying to figure out how the AF worked let alone pilot training, oh and I got back from IFS and they bumped me up two UPT classes. Looking back now, I don't regret it, I'll (Lord willing) be winging in 7 months, and on with my career as a 2nd Lt. with one year in versus some other guys in my class who will be 1st Lts/almost Capts. Nice, im sure we will be the same way once we get going. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archa3opt3ryx Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 I havn't been to IFS yet but after talking to some buddies who just took the test they gave me a few tips like that one: 1) The fuel capacity is "24.0" not "24" 2) For the BF remember to write it out in all capital letters. 3) AIRSPEED - 60 "KIAS" not "KTS" or "KNOTS" 4) FLAPS - "LDG" not "LANDING" Damn. Next thing you're gonna tell me is they all have to be exactly 0.75 inch tall letters. :D Funny about KIAS vs KTS, since the BF says KIAS and the OL says KTS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Noonin Posted January 30, 2012 Share Posted January 30, 2012 (edited) Damn. Next thing you're gonna tell me is they all have to be exactly 0.75 inch tall letters. :D Funny about KIAS vs KTS, since the BF says KIAS and the OL says KTS. It really isn't a difficult game. Write the shit out exactly how it appears. Close enough is not good enough. It's your introduction to the "attention to detail" concept. Edit: Not shitting on you Wolf. But there's a reason that class after class (in IFS and in UPT) fail these simple tests. Dudes just don't seem to believe it when they are told that it must match exactly. Edited January 30, 2012 by Danny Noonin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smokey Posted February 1, 2012 Author Share Posted February 1, 2012 Wondering if anyone can answer this question. The Boldface and ops limits for the DA-20 posted on the pre-arrival guide off the dossifs.com website, are they changed every month or annualy?I plan on studying them now before I go to IFS in 3 months, but I want to make sure they wont change the information anytime soon. Boldface hasn't changed since inception. The ops limits changed last year with the switch to a different fuel control and the associated numbers with it. Cheers, Smokey Good questions, I'd like to know too. Also, Smokey, don't know if you can answer this, but what is the format of the BF/OL test? It is exactly like the tables they give you in the arrival guide, but with the operations or numbers blanked out? Like, we'll get a piece of paper that says "Engine fire on the ground, Electrical fire on the ground", etc, then we write in "Fuel Shutoff Valve - Off, Cabin Heat - Off" under it? The BF is the exact same form with the title in each block that you fill in. All capital block letters, so your example should be.... FUEL SHUTOFF VALVE - OFF CABIN HEAT - OFF Practice typing and writing the BF. Ops limits only have blanks on the "red" lines for fill in by the student. The "red" ops limits are more critical to the phase of flight and must be known for instant recall. Not that the other limits aren't important and you will probably be asked them on your checkride. But the "red" ones are critical at the beginning just as is the boldface. Most flights use two methods to test the BF and OL. A test through the computer via GTIMS, and then the written format that matches the welcome package. You need to be proficient at both as you'll do a handwritten BF as part of your checkride.....just like in UPT. It has to be exact on the ops limits as well. For instance, total usable fuel is 24.0 gallons, not 24, and so on. Smokey It really isn't a difficult game. Write the shit out exactly how it appears. Close enough is not good enough. It's your introduction to the "attention to detail" concept. Edit: Not shitting on you Wolf. But there's a reason that class after class (in IFS and in UPT) fail these simple tests. Dudes just don't seem to believe it when they are told that it must match exactly. Shack! 12-07D is still in blues. They get to re-attack on Thursday. And, I'm sure most feel pretty pissed as the other two flights are in bags. It's a simple enough directive. Do it this way and pay the proper attention to detail. Do it wrong, and you get to change your uniform a few times a day. I hate seeing them in blues but it is their task to conquer. There is no spoon feeding at IFS. Smokey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archa3opt3ryx Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) The BF is the exact same form with the title in each block that you fill in. All capital block letters, so your example should be.... FUEL SHUTOFF VALVE - OFF CABIN HEAT - OFF Practice typing and writing the BF. Ops limits only have blanks on the "red" lines for fill in by the student. The "red" ops limits are more critical to the phase of flight and must be known for instant recall. Not that the other limits aren't important and you will probably be asked them on your checkride. But the "red" ones are critical at the beginning just as is the boldface. Most flights use two methods to test the BF and OL. A test through the computer via GTIMS, and then the written format that matches the welcome package. You need to be proficient at both as you'll do a handwritten BF as part of your checkride.....just like in UPT. It has to be exact on the ops limits as well. For instance, total usable fuel is 24.0 gallons, not 24, and so on. Smokey Got it, thanks. Couple more questions, if you don't mind... 1. On the BF, the procedures for Abort are THROTTLE - IDLE, BRAKES - AS REQUIRED, and FLAPS - CRUISE. Why cruise? For an aborted takeoff, wouldn't you want to make the aircraft as draggy as possible? Full flaps are practically like speed brakes on most aircraft I've flown. Sure, if you're going above 55 you might pop off the ground for a sec, but with the engine cut and full flaps, you'll drop back down damn quick and stay there. 2. Similarly, for an engine malfunction it says to maintain 60 KIAS. Wouldn't you want to go to best glide (73) until you're on short final and you know you'll make the runway? Also, I know you've mentioned a few times that no one cares how you were taught to fly before, the point of IFS is to teach you how to fly the AF way, and to just shut up and do it. I'm fine with that, but I'd like to know why I'm doing it that way. The AF does a lot of crap that doesn't make sense, but I'd like to think we're pretty damn good at flying. Do IP's, either at IFS or UPT, mind students asking "why" questions like those, as long as you don't argue and do it? Edited February 4, 2012 by LoneWolf121188 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Getzen2 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Got it, thanks. Couple more questions, if you don't mind... 1. On the BF, the procedures for Abort are THROTTLE - IDLE, BRAKES - AS REQUIRED, and FLAPS - CRUISE. Why cruise? For an aborted takeoff, wouldn't you want to make the aircraft as draggy as possible? Full flaps are practically like speed brakes on most aircraft I've flown. Sure, if you're going above 55 you might pop off the ground for a sec, but with the engine cut and full flaps, you'll drop back down damn quick and stay there. 2. Similarly, for an engine malfunction it says to maintain 60 KIAS. Wouldn't you want to go to best glide (73) until you're on short final and you know you'll make the runway? Also, I know you've mentioned a few times that no one cares how you were taught to fly before, the point of IFS is to teach you how to fly the AF way, and to just shut up and do it. I'm fine with that, but I'd like to know why I'm doing it that way. The AF does a lot of crap that doesn't make sense, but I'd like to think we're pretty damn good at flying. Do IP's, either at IFS or UPT, mind students asking "why" questions like those, as long as you don't argue and do it? You put flaps up to minimize lift and put as much weight on the landing gear as possible as to not skid the tires. Brakes stop the airplane, not drag. For the 60 KIAS, that BF (if i remember correctly) is for engine failure sufficient rwy remaining to land. 60 KIAS will set up for a landing attitude withe the flaps being lowered to the LDG position. Edited February 4, 2012 by Getzen2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThreeHoler Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 Do they do the UPT thing of each letter must be wholly unconnected to the others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brabus Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 The AF does a lot of crap that doesn't make sense, but I'd like to think we're pretty damn good at flying. Do IP's, either at IFS or UPT, mind students asking "why" questions like those, as long as you don't argue and do it? It doesn't make sense because you don't understand it, which is exactly why you should ask questions. Any IP not willing to take questions is a horrible IP, so yes, ask away, but realize there's a right way to ask a question and a wrong way. Additionally, don't be the guy who could easily find the answer in writing, but is too lazy to read the -1, 2-XXv3, etc. If you read something and don't understand it (including why it's done that way) then ask, but put some effort into finding and figuring it out yourself first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lbzrider14 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 If anyone is curious, class 12-07D (Diesel Flight), 7 busts out of 26 on day one. Other flights sucked as well. A challenge to all future IFS students, if a whole class, that means all 3 flights, passes the BF and OPs Limits day one, I'll buy the class a round on First Friday. Safest bet I ever made....... Smokey Is there any way to get a hold of an email roster for my upcoming IFS class in 2 months? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest lbzrider14 Posted February 4, 2012 Share Posted February 4, 2012 (edited) Got it, thanks. Couple more questions, if you don't mind... 2. Similarly, for an engine malfunction it says to maintain 60 KIAS. Wouldn't you want to go to best glide (73) until you're on short final and you know you'll make the runway? In the ops limits, the "Forced landing FINAL APPROACH airspeed (flaps on takeoff)" is "60". Since the flaps will be set to t/o during departure, this just confirms that if you have a malfunction during takeoff and have sufficient runway remaining to land, you will carry out a "forced landing final approach airspeed (flaps t/o)" profile.... 60 knots. Took me while to figure that one out. Edited February 4, 2012 by lbzrider14 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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