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1 hour ago, brabus said:

2. COCOMS need to be told go fuck themselves by their air counterparts when they ask for unnecessary stuff/people.

 

Agreed... reworking of Goldwater-Nichols to put force providers on parity with COCOMs would be good. AFCongressman still lurking around this board?

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19 hours ago, youdontknowthis said:

- He acted as if he had never heard of considering pro pay for pilots., when compared to doctors and how they get paid. He half serious asked how many of us new how to perform medical procedures as if they are on another level. I wanted to ask how many of them know how to fly but I’ll admit I don’t have the stones to do something like that. 

- He said that $35k was really good for the bonus.
 

How many doctors have 4 to 10 million dollars in training costs? Zero. He is an idiot.

https://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand/pubs/research_reports/RR2400/RR2415/RAND_RR2415.pdf

 

Edited by Merle Dixon
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19 hours ago, youdontknowthis said:




- He said the way they can make things better is to get rid of the queepy stuff and gave an example of how many regs have been gotten rid of.


 

Have they?  I know they renamed a bunch to AFMANs.  Nobody has been able to give me a straight answer as to what that changes.

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4 hours ago, Danger41 said:

I bitch as much as the next guy, but what would be a good thing for leadership to do to show they “care”? Not trolling, I’d love to hear some actual suggestions other than (my standard  game plan) just complaining. 

I bring this up because someone asked me this yesterday as I was holding court and bitching about this and I didn’t have an answer.

big.

dick.

energy.

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1 hour ago, ThreeHoler said:

Renaming changes nothing. Both are mandatory compliance. What does change is the elimination of rules from [some] of those pubs.


Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

I’ve noticed almost 0 difference in my day to day operations/flying. Honestly the only thing I can think of off the top of my head is not confirming my RNAV headings/courses in my GPS with my plate. Maybe I was just already ignoring all the stupid shit they “got rid of”. 

Oh, I now have additional guidance about having to have  flight gloves. 

 

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6 hours ago, Danger41 said:

I bitch as much as the next guy, but what would be a good thing for leadership to do to show they “care”? Not trolling, I’d love to hear some actual suggestions other than (my standard  game plan) just complaining. 

I bring this up because someone asked me this yesterday as I was holding court and bitching about this and I didn’t have an answer.

Say, “We care if you leave. We don’t want you to. And, we’re going to fight to keep you. We’re on the Hill right now fighting for you.”

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22 minutes ago, K_O said:

Say, “We care if you leave. We don’t want you to. And, we’re going to fight to keep you. We’re on the Hill right now fighting for you.”

Had an OG say pretty much that, ask me what he could do to keep me, offered up good ideas, etc. I appreciated him truly valuing my contribution and trying in earnest to make things different so I’d stay. If there were more leaders like him, we wouldn’t have half these issues. So far he hasn’t been fired as a wing/cc, so maybe there’s some hope. 

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I’ve noticed almost 0 difference in my day to day operations/flying. Honestly the only thing I can think of off the top of my head is not confirming my RNAV headings/courses in my GPS with my plate. Maybe I was just already ignoring all the stupid shit they “got rid of”. 
Oh, I now have additional guidance about having to have  flight gloves. 
 


You should probably still QC that...they couldn’t make you before, can’t make you now. Hopefully you never run into a database error or something.

I helped with the C-5 CNS/ATM stuff and I was a little surprised by the chain of custody issues with those databases. I suppose it’s fair to acknowledge I have little trust/faith in people I don’t know (or in general really) as it is.

I’ll always check that shit whether it’s required or not. Is this from the new 217? I’ve yet to even read that thing.

~Bendy
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On 8/16/2019 at 6:38 PM, youdontknowthis said:

- He said if someone wants to get out that they should and he’s fine with that and wouldn’t try to get them to stay. Basically stating what’s done is done and not seeing if anything could be done to keep them in..

Had my OG/CC tell me a version of that when I told him my stay/go decision criteria. I was willing to be convinced to stay in but I knew if I signed on for one more assignment I was signing up for 3 moves and a 365. I just couldn't put my family through that. 

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18 minutes ago, Bender said:

 


You should probably still QC that...they couldn’t make you before, can’t make you now. Hopefully you never run into a database error or something.

I helped with the C-5 CNS/ATM stuff and I was a little surprised by the chain of custody issues with those databases. I suppose it’s fair to acknowledge I have little trust/faith in people I don’t know (or in general really) as it is.

I’ll always check that shit whether it’s required or not. Is this from the new 217? I’ve yet to even read that thing.

~Bendy

 

217 v1/2/3 are now AFMAN 217. All one volume. The old guidance required you to verify the course and distance between your points for a RNAV.  That verbiage was removed. NVG stuff got moved somewhere, some other minor changes. 

Point being, the bobs are saying “look, we eliminated a bunch of pubs and rules!” When in reality they just combined some pubs and reduced redundancies. All the rules are still there. 

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7 hours ago, brabus said:

4. Nobody is equal; be unapologetic about aircrew being more important to the mission than finance (doesn’t mean they’re not an important part, but the rack and stack of priority jobs to the mission is clear).

 ....placates to butt hurt snuffy when he laments pilots being prima donnas .

....I could go on, but what all of these things have in common is showing value to your people and their mission.

 

Am I the only one that sees a disconnect? I’ve been aircrew, then Intel, and now Cyber, so I get both sides.

If you fix, load, AND fly the jet, then you truly are worth more than everybody else.   But keep in mind that Snuffy May have spent his shift getting your jet code 1.  

You end by saying that leadership needs to value your people and their mission. That applies to non bag wearers too.

i know who the audience is here but you guys occasionally act like you’re singing “Cus I’m a Pilot” by Dos Gringos And taking it seriously.

standing by for return fire...

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217 v1/2/3 are now AFMAN 217. All one volume. The old guidance required you to verify the course and distance between your points for a RNAV.  That verbiage was removed. NVG stuff got moved somewhere, some other minor changes. 
Point being, the bobs are saying “look, we eliminated a bunch of pubs and rules!” When in reality they just combined some pubs and reduced redundancies. All the rules are still there. 


I was tracking on the consolidation. I certainly hope we aren’t including that effort into the “reduction of queep” effort. If Instrument Flight Rules were in the target of “queep”, we are worse off than I thought!

~Bendy
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IDGAF if Maj Gen Wills “cares” about anything or not. He’s got a job to do, and it’s extremely disappointing that he doesn’t grasp the concept of increased retention pay being cheaper than the expense of replacing experienced guys. He also thinks he can’t afford to compete with the airlines, which is a foolish take on the problem. The truth is that he’s spending billions to train the airlines pilots for them.

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24 minutes ago, xaarman said:

Honestly, if you’re still in beyond your initial commitment, that’s on you. By the Major point, you know the rules and requirements of the game. 

 

Dont stay with a girl hoping she’ll change. Nothing different here either. 

This.

For those who lament the fact that AF management (and your elected politicians) don’t care about the impact of a pilot retention crisis on national security and the likely potential for an increase in deaths/mishaps... well, it’s because they really don’t care.  We won’t lose wars against near-peers because we won’t get into them, just approach them enough to scare folks into more spending.  That’s by design.  If a few dozen pilots mort because of abbreviated/inadequate training, well, America at large doesn’t care.

It’s not about winning wars or providing national security, at least not as the primary goal.  You’re but a peon in the massive jobs program that is the Defense Industrial Complex, too big to fail.  As others have said... once you understand that the purpose of the Department of Defense is to spend taxpayer money, everything starts to make sense.

Life is far, far better with active duty AF in the rear view mirror.  

Edited by Karl Hungus
F you autocorrect
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1 hour ago, Majestik Møøse said:

IDGAF if Maj Gen Wills “cares” about anything or not. He’s got a job to do, and it’s extremely disappointing that he doesn’t grasp the concept of increased retention pay being cheaper than the expense of replacing experienced guys. He also thinks he can’t afford to compete with the airlines, which is a foolish take on the problem. The truth is that he’s spending billions to train the airlines pilots for them.

What if he said Pro Pilot pay should be $300k/year? He can't make that happen, but apparently it would make a lot of folks feel better.

 

As I slowly disconnect from my past life, I still chime in here because I like Base Ops. But it will be the same complaining as when I was a junior Captain, to senior Captain, and now a few years post separation... and people are still complaining about the same stuff. 

 

The time is ripe to get out. But as I said above, don't stay with the girl hoping she'll come around in the next 1-4 years... it ain't happening. 

 

 

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11 hours ago, Danger41 said:

I bitch as much as the next guy, but what would be a good thing for leadership to do to show they “care”? Not trolling, I’d love to hear some actual suggestions other than (my standard  game plan) just complaining. 

I bring this up because someone asked me this yesterday as I was holding court and bitching about this and I didn’t have an answer.

Publicly propose sweeping changes to the AF and DoD, engage Congress and the media, if there is no traction on reform, resign en masse.

If you truly want to change the system you must be willing to sacrifice, rationalizing that you will fix it from the inside is bullshit.

If GOs, started punching out and saying that which is known but not acknowledged at the highest echelons, you could potentially build the consensus in Congress for necessary change. 

That's an if and it is a risk/sacrifice but that is the only way to get the pols and relevant media's attention to make a persuasive argument.

Easy for me to say as an internet nobody but that's all I got.

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Somebody asked if anyone’s seen any changes yet as a result of all the hyperbole... From my little corner all I can see is a bunch of wheel spinning and cheap talk. While the reality remains - with every passing month, as more of my brothers walk out the door, my days get longer. Nothing short of WW3 could make me stay past my commitment at this point.


Sent from my iPhone using Baseops Network mobile app

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9 hours ago, SuperWSO said:

Am I the only one that sees a disconnect? I’ve been aircrew, then Intel, and now Cyber, so I get both sides.

If you fix, load, AND fly the jet, then you truly are worth more than everybody else.   But keep in mind that Snuffy May have spent his shift getting your jet code 1.  

You end by saying that leadership needs to value your people and their mission. That applies to non bag wearers too.

i know who the audience is here but you guys occasionally act like you’re singing “Cus I’m a Pilot” by Dos Gringos And taking it seriously.

standing by for return fire...

It was a simple, broad statement to make a point...and yes, vectored at the general audience here. Do I think I’m more important than a CCT, the guys I literally trust my life with to ensure my jet is good to go, the O/D cyber guys who are doing an incredibly important job, etc...no, I’d put us on parity.  My point was the AF should not simply disregard the MSG/MDG and treat them like shit, but the AF should happily acknowledging operators of jets, PRC-152s and Off/Def keyboards are the ones fighting the wars, and everything else is support.  Support should not get the same priority as ops, period.  So when some support guy bitches about something, “noted Snuffy” should be the reply, not “oh no, well my first priority as a leader is to make sure nobody is butt hurt, so I’ll bow to your low SA complaint/request, even though I know it will interfere with my pilots’ ability to effectively do their mission.”

We are the only branch who is full retard on this. Leaders don’t need to be assholes about it, but what ops (or their direct supporters) need to get the mission done with least amount of barriers is more important than the flavor of the week the MSG is bitching about.

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I bitch as much as the next guy, but what would be a good thing for leadership to do to show they “care”? Not trolling, I’d love to hear some actual suggestions other than (my standard  game plan) just complaining. 
I bring this up because someone asked me this yesterday as I was holding court and bitching about this and I didn’t have an answer.

I’ve been amazed at how much hiring back support staff has mattered: current ops & UDM contractors, enlisted personnelists, and our OG actually trying to work some human performance initiatives aimed primarily at aircrew. That last one moved the needle a little bit for me.

Maybe if wings could keep finance/MPF/med open until 1630, or have some after hours CDC options for the shift work guys, that might help too. Me personally, I wish we had some actual big blue tech support just it doesn’t take 20 damn minutes to open my email each time. What about a non-flying position to work DTS issues?

I’d say block training of annual/biannual GT requirements would be huge, but that’s another topic altogether. Sure would be nice to block out 2 weeks and knock everything out instead of scheduling a couple dozen courses individually.

The AF has decided it’s unable or unwilling to buy our commitment commensurate with the airlines. Fine. But a focused use of our time would address a lot of our gripes? If I didn’t have to waste so much of my time taking care of queep, maybe I could focus on my job aviating, and do so in a reasonable time.
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The vector we've been on for the last two decades is a function of skin in the game or lack there of. Flag officers have the veneer of authority without any culpability. Goldfein had a tremendous opportunity to right the ship when he first took his post. He could have outlined his expectations to the all of us and said non-compliance will be addressed ruthlessly. After his first 3 months in office, he should've made unannounced visits to the 3 largest wings of AMC, ACC, and AETC respectively. Once it became obvious to him that the intent he issued was not being taken seriously, he should have fired the OG, WG/CC, and NAF/CC of each base. I have a sneaking suspicion when he came back for his next visit, things would look different at most wings. From there we could find creative ways to implement the optimum way to handle or completely jettison non-essential "training."

It's nauseating to watch these Flags act like all of this is rocket surgery. The timidity that management exhibits when forced to make even the most benign decision is embarrassing...I don't have a lot of answers for how to fix our problems, but I know for sure that traipsing around in your Gulfstream just to tell your CGOs that your hands are tied is not what will stanch this gushing arterial wound.

 

Edited by Royal
Grammars
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