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What's wrong with the Air Force?


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38 minutes ago, SuperWSO said:

Cyber is one of the only communities that share a problem with the pilot world: high training/entry requirements, and a robust market outside the military willing to pay for talent.

The other community being doctors... but then they get bonuses commensurate with their training and the outside market. Seems to work for them. So weird.

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10 hours ago, brabus said:

WG/CC said take the “last option” or you can retire to one of them, and the same except here’s a shit sandwich 365 to the other (he separated at 18 years).

This sort of thing has been standard for a decade or longer.  And management wonders why people are bailing to the airlines in droves...and those that stay (or can’t leave yet) are stuck working for the dregs that are left.  

This may be my new rule for an air force career:  RUN!  Fucking run!!  Management doesn’t deserve your sacrifice.

(the old rules being:

1. Timing is Everything

2. Life isn’t fair

3. There is no justice)

Edited by Bergman
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So word around the camp fire is that it’s official that the next AFSOC CC is the one and only Jim Slife. My interactions with him were very minor, but the reputation is atrocious. Anybody have any better info or is this news appropriately placed in the “What’s Wrong with the Air Force” thread?

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1 hour ago, Danger41 said:

So word around the camp fire is that it’s official that the next AFSOC CC is the one and only Jim Slife. My interactions with him were very minor, but the reputation is atrocious. Anybody have any better info or is this news appropriately placed in the “What’s Wrong with the Air Force” thread?

It’s official, was announced by the DoD on Thursday. 

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13 hours ago, Danger41 said:

So word around the camp fire is that it’s official that the next AFSOC CC is the one and only Jim Slife. My interactions with him were very minor, but the reputation is atrocious. Anybody have any better info or is this news appropriately placed in the “What’s Wrong with the Air Force” thread?

How fighter guys felt when Norty Schwartz was nominated, I went to an AF Ball where he was the guest speaker......that was atrocious.  

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5 hours ago, matmacwc said:

How fighter guys felt when Norty Schwartz was nominated

What did you (fighter guys) expect after Buzz would not get with the program (grow, stabilize and mature the RPA enterprise, accquire Light Attack, etc...) and put a greater percentage of institutional focus/effort/comment/resources/etc... on the fight we were in then (still are) instead disproportionately focusing on the next big fight?  

Particularly after some of the public comments by Gates, his boss?  He didn't have to shift the whole of the AF to the counter-insurgency fight at the time but he sure as hell could have shown he "got it" and had a better plan to answer his boss' priorities 

Not saying that he (Buzz) or any other CSAF should not have that in his cross check but we shift focus at times as required to shoot the pop-up 3m target and then return to the 25m target looming...

No particular love for Norty nor strong dislike, could have done better IMHO but the "fighter general" community needed some feedback.

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...the "fighter general" community needed some feedback.

Back in ‘07 timeframe I remember when I supported the COIN mentality wondering why we wanted so many -22’s.

12 years later I eat my words. We’ve seemed to learn nothing, still bogged down in the Stan. Still have supersonic A/A fighters and low level swept wing supersonic bombers spinning holes instead of light attack.

A lot of criticism from many corners back then was based on the belief we had competent decision makers elsewhere.

Now we’ve worn out our fighter fleet, short F-22’s and thinking about buying new F-15’s.

Hindsight


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2 hours ago, di1630 said:

Back in ‘07 timeframe I remember when I supported the COIN mentality wondering why we wanted so many -22’s.
12 years later I eat my words. We’ve seemed to learn nothing, still bogged down in the Stan. Still have supersonic A/A fighters and low level swept wing supersonic bombers spinning holes instead of light attack.
A lot of criticism from many corners back then was based on the belief we had competent decision makers elsewhere.
Now we’ve worn out our fighter fleet, short F-22’s and thinking about buying new F-15’s.
Hindsight

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Yup - I have since moved on from that idea...

The economic exchange between belligerents in war is perhaps the most dehumanizing metric but always relevant.

The fact our leaders then and to some extent now keep trying to keep the future at arms length and will not wholly reconfigure the AF when there are multiple systemic problems bordering on failures is indicative we need an outsider, empowered to fundamentally reform to change, not holding breath.

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7 hours ago, di1630 said:


Back in ‘07 timeframe I remember when I supported the COIN mentality wondering why we wanted so many -22’s.

12 years later I eat my words. We’ve seemed to learn nothing, still bogged down in the Stan. Still have supersonic A/A fighters and low level swept wing supersonic bombers spinning holes instead of light attack.

A lot of criticism from many corners back then was based on the belief we had competent decision makers elsewhere.

Now we’ve worn out our fighter fleet, short F-22’s and thinking about buying new F-15’s.

Hindsight


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In 2007, did you take into account TAMI21 and the near zeroing of 11F production in the name of reasons? 

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1 hour ago, BeerMan said:

I'm on the fence about Light Attack. There is no way OSD would have purchased enough light attack back in 2008 in the quantities needed to reduce the Ops Tempo for other fighter squadrons to dial back. BCA made sure of that. Do you think Light Attack would have changed our behavior in any of the AORs? I don't think so. Now it's too little, too late for our National Security Strategy and it doesn't rank high enough on the priority list in its current form. 

Assuming a good enough number of LA purchased, I doubt it would have changed any behavior down range. However, I would say it would have some pros and cons. Pros, major cost savings. Especially if you forward deploy aircraft with ground units like it should be. Also it would have saved much of the fighter/bomber fleets in terms of wear and tear. Side bonus, if properly trained, forward deploying into a true joint environment would help repair the Army/Air Force relationship.Cons, higher risk of losing an aircraft/aircrew and the political fallout associated with that

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2 hours ago, BeerMan said:

I expected responsible long term decisions that were made on the basis of maintaining the United States' ability to defend itself and its allies.

The decision to end F-22 production (by Sec Gates) and the direction to get 60 ISR CAPs remain two extremely short sighted decisions that have had a significant negative impact, and have placed the Air Force and the United States in the strategically "high risk" position we are in today. I agree with what di1630 stated above.

Even at 350 F-22s (instead of ~700 planned or the 180 we ended up with) you would have twice the number of F-22s squadrons (two more wings), and probably twice the F-22 B-Course production capability. It's debatable, but I think you would have been able to retire the F-15C (~2020), we avoid the whole "retire the A-10" debacle, and you would have developed a much more robust 5th Gen fighter and maintenance force. You reduce your pilot and maintainer absorption problem, and have a positive impact on the retention problem. (diversified assignment options, Eagle guys don't  just ping between overseas England and Japan, increased F-16 and F-15E opportunities in the F-22, and you have a lot more F-22 pilots to go straight to the F-35). Overall you have a more capable force, and hedged a lot of the risk in the F-35. Do I want guys to fly a new F-15X vs a 40 year old F-15C, hell yeah, but it blows my mind that we're going to buy 12 of them in 2020 to try and address a capacity issue. OSD did it to us. Bold leadership means standing up for what you believe in. Hell, maybe they (OSD) made what they thought was the best decision at the time, but right now it sure as hell looks like it was a poor decision.   

It has taken us a DECADE (2009-2019) to "grow, stabilize, and mature the RPA enterprise." The insatiable demand for 60 CAPs? All that did was create programs like TAMI 21, and crush the will of 11F/11Ms in the 2004-2010 timeframe, and create the false notion that leadership can watch the war through a soda straw and hold decision authority at the highest level. This has directly impacted the current retention crisis we are in with 11Fs. We learned that again in 2013 when we could have ended OIR before it started had we gone on the offensive, but instead we held back, played whack a mole and 5 years later we're "closing up shop" even though were aren't going anywhere. It will go on.   

Add the Budget Control Act of 2011 on top of those poor decisions and it's no wonder the Air Force (and really the Army and the Navy but for different reasons) have the force structure, retention, and unbalanced strategic skills challenges facing them today. Now a lot would have happened between then and now, but love or hate Buzz he actually had the foresight to think ahead. Gates and OSD put us on this path, and Congress and the Executive branch kept us there. Again, easy to look back in hindsight, but Buzz was right. 

I'm on the fence about Light Attack. There is no way OSD would have purchased enough light attack back in 2008 in the quantities needed to reduce the Ops Tempo for other fighter squadrons to dial back. BCA made sure of that. Do you think Light Attack would have changed our behavior in any of the AORs? I don't think so. Now it's too little, too late for our National Security Strategy and it doesn't rank high enough on the priority list in its current form. 

Likewise on decisions to defend the US and its Allies so I will still hold Buzz and other CSAFs to some account (and other Chiefs of other branches, DoD officials, etc...) for not building a portion of their respective forces to run marathons versus sprints.  

No hate for Buzz (or his predecessor Jumper) but legitimate critique IMHO, not saying that his push for more Raptors was wrong in the long-term but that his inability or inactivity in reacting to his boss' number one priority (the immediate fight) caused the rift that put a lot of bad blood between Congress/OSD and the AF, ultimately wounding the AF's long term priorities and not effectively meeting civilian leadership's priorities. 

Even if you think your boss has it wrong and you've made your case to the contrary but to no avail, you can either quit or come up with a way to execute his priorities in what you think is the best overall way possible.  His priorities get met and you give him an acceptable way to let you meet what you think is the long term strategy for the AF, in this case it would be extended Raptor production, likely at the expense of something else but you take action.  Buzz was right that we needed more Raptors but was wrong in that he didn't say "I hear you boss, we need to be ready for the future and win the fight today.  We need more Raptors and meet the COIN/LIC air mission(s), here's how we do it boss..."

We need at least 350+ Raptors, get a supplemental appropriation and/or let me reprogram these resources and curtail X capability.

60 CAPs, X above our steady state? Need you to get a supplemental appropriation and/or let me reprogram these resources and curtail X capability.  

Etc...  Life is about choices boss, choose to print mo' money or divest stuff you don't need.

As to Light Attack, I think it would have helped if robustly executed to meet the operational need to replace the 4/5 gen in permissive environments and strategic need to keep them training / conserved for the big fight(s).  Robust means probably an acquisition of 200 tails and crewed at 3.0 to absorb aircrew, sustain rotations, spread operational experience, etc... It would also mean buying a platform legitimately capable of replacing a 4/5 gen in the wheel, i.e. a Scorpion rather than a relatively short range, short endurance, fixed architecture platform.

What's done is done.

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On 3/9/2019 at 6:02 PM, Danger41 said:

So word around the camp fire is that it’s official that the next AFSOC CC is the one and only Jim Slife. My interactions with him were very minor, but the reputation is atrocious. Anybody have any better info or is this news appropriately placed in the “What’s Wrong with the Air Force” thread?

https://www.af.mil/About-Us/Biographies/Display/Article/743377/brigadier-general-brad-m-sullivan/

Just wait.  I will weep for you if this happens. 

ATIS

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1 hour ago, Majestik Møøse said:

He’s got a DFC. Story behind it?

He’s got 2, both for leading formation airfield seizures in OEF and OIF if I’m not mistaken.

 

1 hour ago, ATIS said:

Worst leader I ever ran across since I entered the service in ‘92. We all dreaded going to work. 

ATIS

Interesting.  I had the complete opposite experience with his leadership (at multiple levels).  He’s got a great reputation in the Talon community, phenomenal pilot.  FWIW I’m pretty sure he’s not in running for AFSOC/CC, supposedly ruffled too many feathers when he was CJSOAC-A/CC.  Elton maybe, he’s headed to be the SOCOM J3 here this summer.

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"supposedly ruffled too many feathers when he was CJSOAC-A/CC"

That was my exposure to him...and I wasn't really in his direct Chain of Command.  I had another boss...but shared some common ground, and I camped out in his space.

Regardless...when I showed up to take over and serve my time....I asked why my replacement (and others on the floor) had makeshift rear view mirrows at their stations pointing aft.  It was to see him walking down the hall.  When we moved to a new location, we quickly got rid of the mirrors because we all recognized the sound of his door opening on the new carpet.  As the CC, I was just amazed at how he treated his folks (badly and in some cases just plain mean).  Bless the 05 that was his deputy on the floor....great guy and good at shielding most of the folks from the frag, but not always.  I surely hope he is doing well because he earned his stipes there and was a good dude as well (actually all the folks there were pretty damn 5x5...except for my U-28 Bro....had to always give him crap).   

His operational experience may be untouchable...and that I can't speak too.  All I can relate is watching him as the CJSOAC-CC, and I felt sorry for the AFSOC folks on the floor.   You could feel the sense of relief when the new CC came in, no more looking over your shoulder and just working the mission.  

Don't take this as me throwing crap toward the USAF....we have tons of folks like this on the Navy side...heck, maybe more.  

ATIS  

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"supposedly ruffled too many feathers when he was CJSOAC-A/CC"

 Like calling an entire B Hut of Dracos to attention for an MWR inspection? I thought we were under attack. Crew rest be damned.

 

Say what you want about Slife but he never did that.

 

I know I am going to get shit piled on me but Slife never BSed anyone. I also didn’t think it was in appropriate to ask for accountability in scheduling of his squadron commanders.

 

“Why did you submit a 2407 to land early only to turn around and land at the original time?”

 

Crickets.

 

Maybe the approach was abrasive but I could respect it. We are AFSOC yes and we need to be flexible but we aren’t a flying club.

 

 

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13 hours ago, Skitzo said:

 Like calling an entire B Hut of Dracos to attention for an MWR inspection? I thought we were under attack. Crew rest be damned.

 

First few years of DRACO('06-'08) the Boss did a great job protecting us.  Never sensed the CJSOAC, althought some of the USAF types had to take the walk down the hallway to feed the bear a few times.  We were left alone and just did the mission...and being new kids on the block and needing to earn our keep...I am glad we had that cover.  It was only toward the end of my time (2008-ish) that the creep started to happen.  USAF produced crews (front and back) [vice hand picked, by name request front and back seaters] started to filter in.  That's when CJSOAC went to 11.  The new boss's for sure weren't "Old Breed"...they were managment.  Not saying that was bad...but you could tell they had a new master to serve.  Fast forward to 2013-14 when I came back for a touch and go in my Bragg capacity....it was full on stupid at that point.  The squadron I once knew, cowboy-ish...just fly and do the mission and keep the GFC's/JTAC's happy and calling on us, was long dead and buried.  Still great guys and gals flying the mission and did great work on station...but not the same culture as the original bunch.  

I am sure we all miss it to some degree...but in the back of our minds we knew we were at that right place at the right time....and it woudn't last.  And it didn't.

My buds locked the door of our B-hut when someone wearing a USAF uniform tried to come in from what I heard (I was flying days).  Boss intercepted them before they tried again and that was the last we heard.  

ATIS

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