North Korea at it again

[Smokin]

True, but the first half of billy's post would be a serious problem for NK should they attack. The areas directly south of the DMZ in the most likely attack routes are not that wealthy and would probably not be too impressive, but it as they get more than 6-9 miles from the DMZ that rapidly changes. Although, it won't look quite as nice by the time they get there with the hundreds of thousands of rounds per hour landing in Seoul on opening day...

[billy pilgrim]

I agree with you HOSS that people view others through their own culture. A great current example of this is why the US populace doesn't seem to get why Afghanistan (generally a tribal / Muslim culture) doesn't want to be like the United States - weird.

I also agree that the NK populace has been completely brainwashed by a tightly controlled State run media and highly sheltered from the outside (internet etc...). Probably more than any other group of people currently around the globe.

I've talked to a couple people who lived in Soviet Russia in the 1980's and read Viktor Belenkos book which talks about why he defected. Granted it's a very limited perspective but the general consensus I've heard was that in Soviet Russia people didn't really know what it was like on the outside, but they sure didn't like it there. Lots of complaints about corruption, censorship, what you could wear, talk about, religious opposition, it could be hard to get enough food to provide for your entire family etc...

What VERY little I know about life in North Korea has come from a random documentary or two, Escape from Camp 14 (based on the story of a defector) and Team America World Police / Dennis Rodman. So yeah, take that with a grain of salt. They might be so far gone that it's a lost cause - but I would like to think that most would be ecstatic at the concept of being able to afford as much food as you could possibly eat with just a normal job, while the freedom of speech stuff and being able to vote just gravy...

Anyway you look at it, it's a terrible situation for basically all North Koreans.

[Butters]

http://www.policymic.com/mobile/articles/32263/north-korea-news-is-all-hype

So why are we worried?

[brewskis]

http://www.cnn.com/2....html?hpt=hp_t2

Pentagon officials, while decrying North Korean saber-rattling, said recent announcements of U.S. military deployments in response to belligerent statements by North Korea may have contributed to the escalating tensions between the countries.

As the bombast reaches a fever pitch, the United States is refining its message toward North Korea. The Pentagon now says it is working to decrease the temperature as it maintains a frank and vigilant stance toward Pyongyang's threats."We are trying to turn the volume down," a Defense Department official said.

"We accused the North Koreans of amping things up, now we are worried we did the same thing," one Defense Department official said.

Are we that nutless now? Jeezus.

[SurelySerious]

http://www.policymic...ews-is-all-hype

So why are we worried?

I think the only reason may be that even though the SKoreans have been aware of this since the 50's, it seem Eun just found out about this war.

[Day Man]

http://www.cnn.com/2....html?hpt=hp_t2

Are we canadian now? Jeezus.

ftfy

[Butters]

I think the only reason may be that even though the SKoreans have been aware of this since the 50's, it seem Eun just found out about this war.

This reminds me of a statement someone made during my tour in Korea "we have not been in Korea for 50 years. We have been in Korea for 1 year, 50 times."

[Learjetter]

I doubt the RoK even wants reunification after we "effect regime change." The cost would be astronomical. Perhaps it's cheaper to just keep paying the asswipe to keep his humanitarian/economic disaster on his side of the border.

Morally, that sucks, even from my ethnocentric view. But how many more Americans should die for the RoK's defense of their economy?

Just sayin...

[Slander]

I doubt the RoK even wants reunification after we "effect regime change." The cost would be astronomical. Perhaps it's cheaper to just keep paying the asswipe to keep his humanitarian/economic disaster on his side of the border.

I've seen anywhere from $60B to $4T depending on to what level you want to unfuck the north. What I read, I think from an article or analysis someone else posted in this thread, was that the mostly accepted amount is that you need to double NK's GDP in 4 years to avoid mass emigration to the south but I think once people in the north see Lotte Mart or E-Mart and can go buy all the food they want, that might change.

I think China is more interested in maintaining the status quo than anyone...they definitely do not want a close US ally sharing a border with them. I think once the April exercise season dies down, Foul Eagle ends, we'll see this dissolve. NK can't put up LFEs like we and the RoK so they rattle their sabre endlessly. Also, in about 2 weeks is time for the reserves to go back to the fields for the spring planting season, so between that and the end of the exercises, as long as nothing goes boom over there, this'll die down.

Dictators care the most about #1, and he has to know that if he starts a war, party's over for him and all his buddies...that's incentive enough to just say a lot of angry sounding shit, then when we don't attack claim a victory that your words prevented the imperialists from starting a war.

[LoneStar]

CNN is reporting that there are two missiles that are ready for launch and that they have been tucked away in some secluded portion of the east. The report suggests it is a Musudan missile which has been successfully tested and launched prior. I wasn't alive during the Cold War, but this seems like a whole new level of action that is cause for concern. While I hope that Slander is right and it is just a massive sabre that he is trying to rattle, it's still concerning.

[GrndPndr]

There is a very good chance these actions are all rhetorical, as NK stands to profit from from these activities, and the activities of others right now. There is also a history of this type of behavior, and the attention that it wrought.

NK Gain:

We have just demonstrated our response. They now know many of the steps we will take in the future to defend the South. This includes everything from our movements to changes in things like what we put on and in the air.

An increase in aid from other states. A big win for NK. They are banking on this eventual outcome.

Fat-little-boy leader demonstrates his resolve to his people, and leadership.

NK can point to an increase in our defensive posture, as an increase in aggressiveness to his people.

Lastly, the western press, who regardless of political affiliation, has at its center - profit from an increase in drama anywhere. For the press, no election can be too close, or for that matter any conflict be too close - to drive listeners and viewers.

Just one big fart all around.

FM

[Tank]

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_289563/contentdetail.htm?contentguid=4N2v2k35

Must not be too bad over there...

[Masshole]

CNN is reporting that there are two missiles that are ready for launch and that they have been tucked away in some secluded portion of the east. The report suggests it is a Musudan missile which has been successfully tested and launched prior. I wasn't alive during the Cold War, but this seems like a whole new level of action that is cause for concern. While I hope that Slander is right and it is just a massive sabre that he is trying to rattle, it's still concerning.

They would not do anything to provoke an automatic military response from us that would ultimately result in the destruction of their regime. Although no one knows how coherently their military functions so there is always the possibility for miscommunication or a commander going rogue.

[Vertigo]

They would not do anything to provoke an automatic military response from us that would ultimately result in the destruction of their regime. Although no one knows how coherently their military functions so there is always the possibility for miscommunication or a commander going rogue.

Thanks for your expert analysis.

[Napoleon_Tanerite]

The concern is that Korean Cartman grew up completely immersed in the NK propaganda machine, even more so than his father. If he genuinely believes their own bullshit every bit of "logic" that has been applied goes right out the window. Even if he believes HALF of the bullshit they spew that's a very bad thing. Furthermore I'm sure all the yes-men surrounding him don't tell him important things like how big of an ass whipping he's in for if he decides to go kinetic.

[Bobby]

The concern is that Korean Cartman grew up completely immersed in the NK propaganda machine, even more so than his father...

I argue that he is more westernized than any of his predecessors. He spent the better part of his adolescence being educated in Switzerland. Doubtful that he could ignore the reality of the "outside world" while growing up in it.

[ThreeHoler]

I argue that he is more westernized than any of his predecessors. He spent the better part of his adolescence being educated in Switzerland. Doubtful that he could ignore the reality of the "outside world" while growing up in it.

This.

[M2]

[matmacwc]

They would not do anything to provoke an automatic military response from us that would ultimately result in the destruction of their regime. Although no one knows how coherently their military functions so there is always the possibility for miscommunication or a commander going rogue.

Rainman is gone, allow me to retort. You have no fucking idea what you are talking about, you have no access to classified, and no access to other shit. You are responding from a position of feeling and emotion, the real world does not work like that little girl, go color in the corner.

[TreeA10]

I guess torpedoing a South Korean naval vessel killing 41 sailors and shelling a South Korean killing 4 civilians in 2010 were glitches in their command and control. Certainly no cause for alarm. Masshole is right, nothing to see here. Just another day on the boarder of a bat shit crazy country...now with nukes.

[Smokin]

.... But how many more Americans should die for the RoK's defense of their economy?

Have you read or watched Camp 14? Some things in life are worth fighting for, even if it is not a direct threat to our country. The RoK's economy is not what I would fight for if this war starts back up.

[Champ Kind]

Have you read or watched Camp 14? Some things in life are worth fighting for, even if it is not a direct threat to our country. The RoK's economy is not what I would fight for if this war starts back up.

Oh, good. Another idealistic "we're gonna free the shit out of you" war.

Because that's what we need right now.

[Smokin]

Oh, good. Another idealistic "we're gonna free the shit out of you" war.

Because that's what we need right now.

Oh, good. Yet another example of baseop's favorite pastime of contorting words beyond all recognition of the original statement. Did I say we should start a war because of the horrific oppression of their people? No. I said "IF THIS WAR STARTS BACK UP" then ending a government that still uses massive Holocaust style concentration camps is a more important reason for me to fight than supporting Samsung and Kia. That is a big difference from your implication that I advocate starting a war over it. A second Korean War would likely kill hundreds of thousands if not millions and is not something that any rational person should want.

[HU&W]

Cliffs notes version of N. Korea today courtesy of the Herald Sun.

[DirkDiggler]

http://us.cnn.com/2013/04/08/world/asia/koreas-tensions/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

And so it continues. I do find it amusing that the media continues to enjoy this constant "breaking news" saga.